The Mustang has a B&M ProRatchet shifter which is compatible with electric or air shifters. Which is the better way to go? Dedenbear makes both, and I'm thinking the electric would be easier than messing with co2 bottles. How do you wire the solenoid? I can use the third step of the three step to trigger the solenoid, but do you need a relay? Any links or tips would be appreciated as always.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

It's a girl's car.
Now how about some tips?

I give him a VERY hard time about it!

Actually she doesn't want one, the crew chief does.

I'll bet all the hitters will have one in their cars for the next race.

So, fron reading Dedenbear's site it doesn't look like the electric will make more than one shift since it needs to be cocked each time. Does anyone else make them?

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve'66:

Now how about some tips?

SteveW

---

Tip #1, get the best most comfertable shifter you can.
Tip #2, get a BIG shift light if she can't follow the tach.
Tip #3, get that sissy shifter nonsence out of your head!

If you want a race car that shifts itself, race the tow vehicle.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve'66:
I'll bet all the hitters will have one in their cars for the next race.

---

But they're not needed. I race in Top (super pro) without one and manage to go some rounds. I personally think they should not be legal in a no box class.

www.acddragparts.com

Automotive Engineering Race Technologies 800 284-3551 (they may have a website)

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

Happy New Year!! You get to take the tree down now.

If Melissa doesn't want it I can use it on "the next project". LOL

They cost more than I thought, $500.....

Maybe it can wait

http://www.acddragparts.com/1401.html

Too many good box racers I know use them. I really doubt if its cause they don't want to shift or that they really want to spend another $500 plus on thier racecars. A shortshift or over shift can easily make .05 difference in E.T. and where I come from, thats usually "race over".

I do agree that they have no place in no box classes. KV and I know a guy that has run an air shifter in no box for years cause the rules, at one time at least, said no electronic driver aids. An air shifter isn't electronic but has to be actuated somehow electrically so I never really understood that ruling. Be that as it may, no electronics should be no electronics.

Mine is run by my delay box Steve. Thats one of the hundred or so things my delay box can do. I can't program a VCR so I've got some learning to do on that.

With my total inexperience at driving, the last day I ran my car last Fall, 3 runs varied by .005. If I can figure out how to cut a light, I'm pretty confident the car can do its job and that shifter helps.

You and I think alike!
I don't care whether or not they should be allowed in no box, the fact that they are is enough for me.
I figure Div 7 gets a kick back from the shifter manufacturers for introducing this rule. We also get to use t-brakes and two/three step out here on the west coast. Our no-electronics class is Street and they have to run Muffs and dot tires too. Street is our version of everyone elses "foot-brake" class. The Sportsman class is 7.50-13.99 sec 1/4 mile ets too, where street is 12.0-20 something ets.

In our weekly Wednesday night races we run "CompRod" which is full electronics cars top bulb, ottom bulb and footbrakers all competing with each other (we have to run Muffs on Wednesday nights too) but slicks and non-dot tires are ok in C/R. So it's not unusual for Melissa to have to run against a SuperGas car on Wednesday nights.

My car is just as consistent as about anyone's I have ever seen, and I not only shift once like the powerslide guys, but twice.

Air or electric shifter as an advantage, maybe,
if your lazy or, cant see.

Trust me there is nothing sissy about winning. I don't know about class racing but MOST of the winners driving in Delay box brackets use the electric or air shifter. Yes they even use throttle stops. No offense meant to anyone here who may not use electrically actuated shifters.

I personally don't like all the electronics, but I'm not so stupid as to say I can do without them and be more "Accurate" than they are. I do electronics work for a living, you can bank on what I just said, it's been proven. The "BEST" driver here or anywhere is not as consistantly accurate as any form of PLC timer using electronics. No need to argue this it's fact. Again no offense meant.

Be that as it may the situation in some classes dictates that to be consistantly competitive, you need to have this stuff. Like I said this may not be the case in some areas of racing. I prefer to shift my own car, and I can do it as good as anyone, but I want it on the money 1000 out of 1000 times, not 999.

I run an electric shifter, not air. I have seen too many guys lose a race because they didn't check the Co2 in the bottle. I use a MSD brand RPM activated switch and run that into a solenoid which activates the the shifter solenoid that gives you the 1-2 upshift. Thats all it does. You can still shift the car yourself if need be. Here is a link to the brand solenoid I use.

Dixie Products

Sorry for the long post. Take care and good luck

Bracket racing is so tough to win at so why not use a legal device that affords a little advantage. Its just like racin against a black digger at night. That is also a totally legal thing that gives the racer some advantage in those situations.

Its also a matter of choice. If ya don't want to, ya don't have to.

I'm sure I'm not changing any opinions here, just my .00002

Right Mike???
I race against some of the best drag racers in the country and I mange to do just all right with no delay box, no sissy shifters, no crossover crap. Sorry, but it all goes against the entire premise of drag racing. If you need all of that electronic crap to bracket race then you probably aren't any good without it is my opinion. If I had to use that stuff I'd stay home and race toy slot cars.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

With all due respect, your competition isn't allowed to use that electronic crap against you either. So you're on a level playing field. That's cool, and we're all pround of you and MoneyMaker racing. In Div.7 if you want to run slicks, you gotta compete against autoshifters. .

What would you do if SuperStock racing legalized delay boxes and auto shifters?

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

I didn't know that! Maybe the sissy shifter manufacturers petitioned NHRA for the rule change.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:

I'd hate to see some of you SISSY SHIFTER proponants "TRY" and race a stick shift car where not only do you have to cut a light, but pop a clutch, and powershift 3 or 4 times ...
I race against some of the best drag racers in the country and I mange to do just all right with no delay box, no sissy shifters, no crossover crap. Sorry, but it all goes against the entire premise of drag racing. If you need all of that electronic crap to bracket race then you probably aren't any good without it is my opinion. If I had to use that stuff I'd stay home and race toy slot cars.

---

Alex,
I wish they would do away with electronics in bracket racing, but I doubt they will. I used to race a 12 second 4 speed mustang in footbrake at Hallsville, Tx, where they still race 1/4 mile. I did quite well too, I still have the winning time slips to prove it. I have raced both the no box and delay box class at the same race, it wasn't easy but it's possible.
I get the feeling some of us think Bracket racing is easy. WRONG.
I also get the feeling this is kinda like that song by RUSH where the OAKS look down on the ELMS. Maybe this would be a good time to point out we are all in the same forrest.
No doubt you race agaisnt some of the very best racers there are. With all due respect, I do know there are some differences between class racing and bracket racing though. Do you bracket race any? There are some very lucrative payouts in some areas. Might be a good oppurtunity.
I don't really like the direction bracket racing is going. We get alot of "Professional" Bracket racers in Mempho lately. I'ts not uncommon at Memphis Motorsports Park to see the Richardson's show up for a $10K race. Some of the 10K races are 30K weekends, with this kind of money going out, it's bound to attract some career bracket racers. I'ts getting to where you need a .05 package to win anymore. The dragsters are taking over the sport.
I'm not complaining though.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

------------------
'70 Mustang Mach 1 - '72 Mustang Sprint - '94 F-150

quote:

---

Originally posted by SteveLaRiviere:
I think ALL shifters are sissy! You should grab the gears with vice grips through a hole in the floor, if you're any kind of a man at all.

---

Now you're talking
In my best Tim Taylor voice "Arrh Arrh Arrh"

How about the bracket racers that run their glide in hi-gear only? Kinda like a legal throttle stop in no-box, and no shifting at all.

If you are racing every advantage you can get to win take it!

I have always used the electric shifters if for no other than the bottle issue.

I know Super Stock racers that use air shifters.

"If you put a dial-in on your window you are a bracket racer!!!"

She probably got a lot more attention as well!

Stickshifts are a lot more fun for the driver AND the spectators... especially when it's a girl at the wheel of an early mustang! She probably had daily marriage proposals. Watching a girl bang gears down the 1320 simply pegs the cool meter!

Watching her ride a recliner down the track is kinda cool as well... since it's still a girl in an early mustang, but it's not nearly as special.

Is it her that wants the automatic/sissy shifter, etc.... or is it dad's competitive spirit? That's the question you need to ask yourself (and your daughter) if you want to keep her interested in racing with you.

Good Luck!

Point well taken, it just depends whether she wants the thrill of driving a few rounds or the thrill of going lots of rounds and collecting trophys and cash. But I'll let her decide. I've got my own toy I'm concentrating on now.

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve'66:
[Bit just depends whether she wants the thrill of driving a few rounds or the thrill of going lots of rounds and collecting trophys and cash[/B]

---

That can be done either way.
Unfortunately, air and electric shifters are not fool proof either. Most electric shifters, if the voltage drops too low, they wont shift at all. Air shifters, if the C02 level gets low, or the outside air pressure changes alot, it will affect how fast or slow they shift.

I always rely on dumb luck too.
A dinosaur with a 4 speed gear grinder feet racer. I can't do it with 1 foot.

quote:

---

Originally posted by kid vishus:
If you feel you are at a dis-advantage because someone has something you dont, you are already behind.

---

Well said, KV!!

I've always figured the more "stuff" a person has to have in the operation of their racecar, the more they have to keep an eye on & it increases their chances of one of those gismo's going haywire! Which, if I'm on my mark, I'll be able to take advantage of and beat him!

All is fair: as Alex hinted to - he likes to work on his car; while other folks apparently would prefer to work on their electronics/computer! But that's what makes us all different!

When a big $$ racer has a problem with their setup - I don't feel sorry for them. They chose their own setup to run, and it failed them.

When a dude walks up and starts slamming me by saying, "Didn't anyone ever tell you, 'stick-shifters are for tractors'?" I feel sorry for him...cause he'll never know the joy I GET when I beat his big-$$ ride in the eyes with my "not-nearly-as-pretty, open-trailered, tractor-trans'd, three-pedal'd, all-steel racecar"!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Ryan Wilke:
All is fair: as Alex hinted to - he likes to work on his car; while other folks apparently would prefer to work on their electronics/computer!

---

Very true Ryan,

We've got a few guys with turbo'd Calloway Vettes and Grand Nationals with lap-top computers permanently mounted in them. It seems like they are constantly on the 'puter.

quote:

---

Originally posted by kid vishus:

If you feel you are at a dis-advantage because someone has something you dont, you are already behind.
I know the electric shifters are accurate and help consistency, but, they are not needed to win.

---

I couldn't have said it better myself Rob.

As far as dial in's go, yes in stock or superstock it's unfortunatly a neccasary evil during eliminations. It doesn't mean that I have to like it though.
I live for the possibility of getting a same class pairing so we can race heads up. That's where the "REAL" overall tallent show's up.
To me drag racing is still all about cutting a light, going fast, and winning rounds. Not deep staging, sandbagging, dragging the brakes or burping through the lights.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:
Since I know how you are Steve and you aren't gonna change your mind, here are some of the better companies.

---

To me this is the most FUNNY part of this post.

I'll keep my opinion to myself because I dont have anywhere near enough experience.

------------------
SCOOP
oddly obsessed with big scoops on little Mustangs

2.26 60'S
14.9 @ 90.86MPH

65 coupe,351w,C4,Big Boss 429 hood scoop,8"3.40 TracLoc,Cragar SS,Black Suede.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:
To me drag racing is still all about cutting a light, going fast, and winning rounds. Not deep staging, sandbagging, dragging the brakes or burping through the lights.

---

amen

all the other crap is why I lost interest many years ago. "Listenting" to Alex and all the other (please forgive me) "grizzled veterans" makes me sad that I did.

------------------
-Paul

70 Mach1 351C
79 Ranchero GT
97 Expedition XLT 5.4
00 SVT f150 Lightning 4149 of 4966 Born on: 06/26/2000

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:
Years ago during my one time entry into "stock car" racing, some guys used to weld 7/16 open end wrenches on to the shift lever nubs. Really!

---

Those were real men!

I sure would like to line up next to one of them at a bracket race too.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:
Years ago during my one time entry into "stock car" racing, some guys used to weld 7/16 open end wrenches on to the shift lever nubs. Really!

---

------------------
-Paul

70 Mach1 351C
79 Ranchero GT
97 Expedition XLT 5.4
00 SVT f150 Lightning 4149 of 4966 Born on: 06/26/2000

quote:

---

Originally posted by Fastymz:
I'll keep my opinion to myself because I dont have anywhere near enough experience.

---

Ron,

Please go ahead and give us your opinion. I'd like to know your opinion as much as everyone else's.

This post has been fun, started by a simple question and evolving into a discussion of bracket racing from its humble begining in the '60s to 2003.

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve'66:
Those were real men!

I sure would like to line up next to one of them at a bracket race too.

SteveW

---

Those old sportsman stock cars didn't go to well in a straight line Steve. They also didn't like pavement much either.
As a matter of fact, they didn't even shift them at all except for backing up.
They would run the race in high gear.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

But I also like the technology of today.I understand that when your racing for money,it's a different game altogether.And you want any all advantages you can afford.

I love to race the high dollar all teched out cars.Because they do fail,and thats always a sweet win.

Give me a self shifting, foot brake, heads up race any day.

If it not fun any more then it's time find something new.

------------------
SCOOP
oddly obsessed with big scoops on little Mustangs

2.26 60'S
14.9 @ 90.86MPH

65 coupe,351w,C4,Big Boss 429 hood scoop,8"3.40 TracLoc,Cragar SS,Black Suede.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:
Years ago during my one time entry into "stock car" racing, some guys used to weld 7/16 open end wrenches on to the shift lever nubs. Really!

---

Wimps! They should have used 3/8!

------------------
'70 Mustang Mach 1 - '72 Mustang Sprint - '94 F-150

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve'66:
Very true Ryan,

We've got a few guys with turbo'd Calloway Vettes and Grand Nationals with lap-top computers permanently mounted in them. It seems like they are constantly on the 'puter.

SteveW

---

There's nothing wrong with that Steve as it doesn't alter the staging or leaving charctaristics. That's how you tune those things.
We use a lap top on Tony's Capri and now the GT convert too. We are not allowed to have them permanently installed, or even in the car while going down the track though. It's the only way you can tune a late model FI computer controlled car. The new Accel DFI and FAST systems are incredible with the amount of adjustments and calibrations they allow. I wish that I could do 1/10 of things on MM. We are now able to get fuel injector duty cycles up over 90% and that was just "Star Wars" technology a couple of years ago.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve'66:
What else can they do with the laptops mounted in the car? Program shift points, timimg curves, fuel curves, boost levels? Can they be used as down track controllers? I think I know the answers, so I'm wondering why they are legal.

SteveW

---

You can only program shift points if you have a programable shifter or transmission.
If you already have a box or delay unit an on board lap top should be an absolute no no.
As I said, we CANNOT have them in the car while racing.
Fuel curves, boost levels? Sure, no different than changing jets or closing up the waste gate.
Down track controllers? Yes, if the other electronics are there it's possible for the entire pass to be programed and controlled start to finish.
Good reason not to allow lap tops in the car isn't it?

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:
You can only program shift points if you have a programable shifter or transmission.
If you already have a box or delay unit an on board lap top should be an absolute no no.
As I said, we CANNOT have them in the car while racing.
Fuel curves, boost levels? Sure, no different than changing jets or closing up the waste gate.
Down track controllers? Yes, if the other electronics are there it's possible for the entire pass to be programed and controlled start to finish.
Good reason not to allow lap tops in the car isn't it?

---

point and shoot. same thing that happened to the SLR camera. PHD. (press here, dummy)

------------------
-Paul

70 Mach1 351C
79 Ranchero GT
97 Expedition XLT 5.4
00 SVT f150 Lightning 4149 of 4966 Born on: 06/26/2000

quote:

---

Originally posted by Fastymz:
I see it both ways,I agree that "REAL"racing is all about the driver and the how well you can set up your car.
But I also like the technology of today.I understand that when your racing for money,it's a different game altogether.And you want any all advantages you can afford.
I love to race the high dollar all teched out cars.Because they do fail,and thats always a sweet win.
Give me a self shifting, foot brake, heads up race any day.
If it not fun any more then it's time find something new.

---

Ron, I agree 100% I'd rather have zero electronics. Some things are taken for granted here though. Even High tech cars have to set their car up well. All the best starting line launch devices won't help a car any if it's not set up correctly. What Alex was referring to earlier is the fact that it is easier for the delay box guy to roll in or out some time in his box, whereas the non-electronics racers has to do other things, like maybe play with front tire pressure or something. There are lots of little tricks like that. I'm sure Alex knows them all. Alot of the newer delay box crowd would be lost because they have no clue as to how to make a car react without the box.
Don't get me wrong your car still has to leave decent with a box.

Another misconception, Delay boxes aren't laptops. Fuel curves can be tuned with a Laptop on EFI cars, but this doesn't mean the same laptop is used as a downtrack trottle stop or launch controller. Another misconception is what you said about beating the teched out cars and feeling good about it because something failed. I guess my earlier post didn't make it clear. Folks it's super rare for electronics to fail. I know I do this stuff to feed the kids. What DOES happen is folks ( myself included ) have a brain fart and put the WRONG thing in the box. Or you're late off the button, or early, the list goes on. Some how we have come to the conclusion that the folks using a "box" are just along for the ride. If you think so then ease on down to Mempho and we will strap you in an easy to drive dragster running 5.0's with all the gizmos and see how you do. You still have to have good eye hand coordination. You still have to intiate something for your car to leave on. More times than not the 4 speed car has the eaiser time of it because he is not in a 4.90 dragster he is in a 7.50 doorslammer. Plenty of time to shift, eat donuts, mail mom, whatever. There are some exceptions to this of course, Alex being one, all the Pro Stock cars being another. Plenty more fast 4 speed cars, but they are rare in Pro brackets.

If you are "ON" your game and pay attention to your wiring in the first place ( same as an ignition ) your gizmos will rarely fail. We all DO run ignitions right? UNLESS they are considered OMG electronic Not trying to offend but you see my point. Regardless of electronics or Mechanical you still have to set your car up right. Everything fails every now and then, but looking at the statistics, it's usually human error on the launch controllers.

Personally, I LOVE beating a guy with alot more invested in his stuff than me. Electronis or not. Although, this happens, it doesn't happen as much in bracket racing as it used to. Hard earned racer tricks from veterans in the sport have been replaced by buy it off the shelf speed, instant win whoever has the most money gadgets, both mechanical and electrical.

I'd rather go back to the OLD days myself. Is that realistic? Not in high dollar bracket racing. There is still room for door cars and no electronics cars at some tracks. But the payouts aren't $10K. They are more like $500.00
I like $10k, I'd kinda like to run those races. May not win any but who knows? Ok I'm offa my soap box now. Corona time. Steve did you know this post was gonna create such a stir?

quote:

---

Originally posted by jsracingbbf:
Steve did you know this post was gonna create such a stir?

---

Jerry,

No I really didn't. Look at my original post, I just wanted some info on how to do it/where to buy the parts.
But, it's all fun. Besides it's winter time and most of the M&M racers that means it's benchracing season.

Personally I want every advantage allowed under the rules. No different than the class racers that find every extra bit of h.p. they can within the rules. I didn't make the rules, just trying to field a semi competitive car.

I've stayed out of this quite a while, but I have to say one more thing.

All the electronic gadgets in the world won't automatically win races. You still have to have a car that you can predict, and be able to cut a light. Delay boxes with crossovers, throttle stops and auto shifters don't win the race by themselves. An awful lot of pretty good box racers I know have trouble crossing over. It's still a tough sport and thats why its fun.

Diversity is also one of the fun aspects of our obsession. Stick shift cars are fun to watch cause many of the drivers of these beasts are not quite wired up right. Power glide bracket cars that will run the same number time after time are fun to watch too. Winning against one is especially satisfying.

To me diversity is the thing that makes the sport fun and unique and makes our country great also. If we all liked the same things it would be pretty boring.

I understand what your saying,I also dont think the systems fail as much as people do.I wrote my other post real poor.I was in no way saying that I could out drive any one.With or with the tech stuff.I do enjoy racing a stick shift more then an auto any day.
But I'll tell you what a well set up auto is a real kick when it shifts hard and dam fast.
I was not trying to say that to beat an all teched was good because they failed.
And trust me if I raced for $10,000 I'd want ever advantage I could get too.
But when you live life 14 seconds at a time.It's all about FUN.

BTW,I got your email about a different subject I tried to email you back.But it keeps getting back to me.I did look at those sites,thanks for the help.

------------------
SCOOP
oddly obsessed with big scoops on little Mustangs

2.26 60'S
14.9 @ 90.86MPH

65 coupe,351w,C4,Big Boss 429 hood scoop,8"3.40 TracLoc,Cragar SS,Black Suede.

DV, let me aks you a quesssion.....
Do YOU have a SISSY SHIFTER in the Falcon?

Hmmmmmmmm?

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

Back to the original question,

A friend of all of us (that wanted to stay out of this) emailed me with a $290 solution. Thanks David

Anyway Biondo has an electric shifter for three speeds. The one for B&M ratchet shifters is SN5070 if anyone cares. LOL

Now, DING let's get back to the bench racing.

SteveW

Yes excellant post, thanks!

quote:

---

Originally posted by Fastymz:
Jerry,just beat me down why dont you.

I understand what your saying,I also dont think the systems fail as much as people do.I wrote my other post real poor.I was in no way saying that I could out drive any one.With or with the tech stuff.I do enjoy racing a stick shift more then an auto any day.
But I'll tell you what a well set up auto is a real kick when it shifts hard and dam fast.
I was not trying to say that to beat an all teched was good because they failed.
And trust me if I raced for $10,000 I'd want ever advantage I could get too.
But when you live life 14 seconds at a time.It's all about FUN.

BTW,I got your email about a different subject I tried to email you back.But it keeps getting back to me.I did look at those sites,thanks for the help.

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by steve'66:
TIME OUT,

A friend of all of us (that wanted to stay out of this) emailed me with a $290 solution. Thanks David

Anyway Biondo has an electric shifter for three speeds. The one for B&M ratchet shifters is SN5070 if anyone cares. LOL

SteveW

---

Next thing you'll be telling us that Melissa is wearing a dress and heels as part of her driving suit Steve.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:

Next thing you'll be telling us that Melissa is wearing a dress and heels as part of her driving suit Steve.

---

No, but she usually has pretty cute blouse on under the RCI jacket.

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:
Brain farts Jerry???
I know ALL about those! :
Good post.

DV, let me aks you a quesssion.....
Do YOU have a SISSY SHIFTER in the Falcon?

Hmmmmmmmm?

Yup, it came in the car. Its staying there, too.

It has a Mega400 box and a linkage CO2 stop.

Like I told KV today, I like the shifter cause right now I'm in a semi state of panic goin down and I firmly clamp the wheel with both hands.

In keeping all this stuff, I'm jumping into the toughest bracket class, as far as I'm concerned, but I bought this car purposely. I may change my mind about brackets, but I can always take all the widgets off and try it that way also.

---

quote:

---

Power glide bracket cars that will run the same number time after time are fun to watch too.

---

This is when I go to the concession stand...

I'd much rather watch a girl bang the gears of an early stickshift mustang to 12 second et's, than watch a BORING recliner car ride down the track to a 9 second timeslip.

I'd have to be a complete invalid on my deathbed before I'd think a car like the ones described was actually fun to drive, let alone watch.... snooze

It's why sportsman racing is not really classified as a spectator sport. About all they get in the stands are family friends of the drivers.

To each their own, I guess...

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

Bracket racing is not a spectator sport, it's a participation sport. A contest between drivers, and funded by driver's/crew entry fees not spectators. We have a handfull of fans that come just to watch, but some of them are gambling on the races. The spectators are fun to watch too.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:
Two dollah on lane one!

---

Yep, One of the bros has a diamond in every one of this gold front teeth. Now that's style....
They do have a blast though. They have big rolls of cash and it flies back and forth between them all night.

Three to five on lane two!

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

------------------
SCOOP
oddly obsessed with big scoops on little Mustangs

2.26 60'S
14.9 @ 90.86MPH

65 coupe,351w,C4,Big Boss 429 hood scoop,8"3.40 TracLoc,Cragar SS,Black Suede.

quote:

---

Originally posted by n2oMike:

This is when I go to the concession stand...

I'd [b]much rather watch a girl bang the gears of an early stickshift mustang to 12 second et's, than watch a BORING recliner car ride down the track to a 9 second timeslip.

I'd have to be a complete invalid on my deathbed before I'd think a car like the ones described was actually fun to drive, let alone watch.... snooze

It's why sportsman racing is not really classified as a spectator sport. About all they get in the stands are family friends of the drivers.

To each their own, I guess...

[/B]

---

quote:

---

Originally posted by jsracingbbf:
But MIke that Boring powerglitch BBf car that is so boring to you......can strap a whoopin on your ride in heads up form.

---

Jerry,

I'd be willing to bet a whole lotta money that it could do it in a bracket race too.
Not to pick on Mike, it's just that bracket racing may be boring to watch but it ain't easy.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

I can take it out on any day the weather is nice for a nice little thrashing to make me feel all nice and de-stressed.

If I want to go to the track, I'll round up some buddies and we have a blast. (We usually only test and tune, and we set up races between ourselves and others) It's a blast, and a real challenge to work a peaky 302 stickshift car on the bottle at the track. There's definitely plenty of action. I've been fairly successful at the FunFord brackets in the nostalgia class that allows no electronics. I went through 5 rounds to get to the semi's once to win $50, and another time I went 5 rounds to get to the top 8, but didn't win any money. (and yes, I was using nitrous and not lifting.

To me bracket racing is boring. I don't have the funds to make a lot of track appearances, and besides, I would rather be fast than consistent. When I go, I'm going for a personal record every run... and get far more attention than those recliner cars that run a second or two faster.

The stick shift makes my car way more streetable than an 8" converter, and more fun to boot.

I refuse to be a slave to some rule making committee that tries to make all the cars the same, and everyone with a pulse competitive. I'll build the car the way I like it, and be happy with it. If there were a road race track somewhere close, I might set it up for some open track duty... now THAT looks like fun! As long as it isn't tubbed, it's easy to switch suspensions back and forth.

That's just my philosophy on the subject... It's a free country, and you guys are free to build your cars however you want. Diversity is what keeps things interesting.

As far as spectating is concerned, it really tough to beat those NMRA, NMCA, ect heads up street car heads up classes. If you haven't seen a Pro-Nostalgia car (such as Charlie Booze's 4-speed 61 Starliner) run 8.99 with a naturally aspirated FE, you just haven't lived! There isn't any recliner car as fun to watch as these guys going CRAZY fast on small tires and huge doses of nitrous! Big wheelies, crossed up starts, etc... You gotta' love it!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

quote:

---

Originally posted by Moneymaker:
I still enjoy watching Pro ET quite a bit. The divirsity of the cars is pretty cool and I get a big kick out of 400+ cube 2700 lb or less cars with 14 inch tires trying to run in the tens.
It's SP with all of the copy cat dragsters and electronics that I really only dislike.

---

The key to enjoying bracket racing (as a spectator) or the super classes is to watch at the finish line. That's where the race equals out. I agree with you about S/C and even S/E, but S/G and S/S are usually door slammers.

Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com

IP: Logged

hee hee

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

quote:

---

Originally posted by kid vishus:
My recliner car.....

---

What I refer to as a recliner car are those idiot proofed double delay boxed, air/electric shifted, underpowered, overtired cars that run the same exact boring way run after run.... with little effort paid towards maximizing the timeslip.

These are the big, but lazy engined powerglide cars that are about as exciting as watching paint dry.

They win their fair share of bracket races, but are about as interesting as a bag of hair.

KidV.... Yours is definitely not a recliner car.

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

quote:

---

Originally posted by Glens67:
[I know the electric shifters are accurate and help consistency, but, they are not needed to win.

---

I always rely on dumb luck too.
A dinosaur with a 4 speed gear grinder feet racer. I can't do it with 1 foot.

[/B][/QUOTE]

Glen,

You don't need dumb luck, how many point championships have you won with that gear grinder (top loader)? Three or four? Keep up the good work!

Ron

quote:

---

Originally posted by rfedd:
To me it boils down to this...in heads up vs ET.
In heads up he with the most $ wins. Just look at the John Forces of the world. The more sponsorship backing the more he (and now his teams) won. Better crew chiefs, better test equipment, computer analysis of every pass, better everything. If we want to level the playing field, limit the amount of dollars each participant can sink into his or her ride.

Ron

---

I don't think so!
It the smarter, more diligent, attention to detail racer who wins heads up races.
The Jerry Tollivers and Whit Bazemores of the world dissprove your theory of cubic dollars.
I regulary out run and out qualify dozens teams that are far more funded than we are.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

Ron

quote:

---

Originally posted by jsracingbbf:
... your car is super quick for a 347..

---

Especially considering the extra mph, and the "soft" 60' time for that ET.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

Ron

------------------
65 FB, 347 CI, C4, 4.56
60: 1.360
1/8: 6.17 @ 112
1/4: 9.74 @ 137

Thanks for the links to the original question.

And you've got a hard running combo! Congrats

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl