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Author
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Topic: Which Carb?
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horseballz
Gearhead Posts: 216
From: LasVegas,NV
Registered: Dec 99
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posted 03-16-2003 12:37 PM
   
I'm asking for expert advice. I know that I'll use either a Holley or an Autolite and I need suggestions. This may be a long post. I will first state what I see as options that I've narrowed down. Then I will tell what I already have.
- Street Avenger with vaccuum secondaries (570? or 670 cfm?)
- Double Pumper between 600 & 700 with vaccuum secondaries.
- Double Pumper between 600 & 700 with mechanical secondaries.
- Autolite (not sure which would be best)
Here's what I've got and what I'm hoping to accomplish:
'68 Coupe, 5.0, T5, 3.25 or 3.55 Gears, 255/60/15 rear tires. I want to make this car into a great highway cruiser (60-90 mph) that will still be snappy and fun around town and have reasonable fuel mileage and rock solid dependability. Here is the engine so far:
- Brand new late model 5.0 from Central Coast Mustangs.
- GT40 "P" heads
- B303 cam
- 1.7 to 1 Ford roller rockers
- Performer RPM
- Mallory Distributor (no coil? or box? yet)
- MAC (I think) coated tri-Y headers to fit the "P" heads
- Ford "Mustang Powered by FORD" aluminum valve covers.Will I have problems with these due to the Ford roller rockers?
Surface street speed limits in Vegas are typically 45 mph except in residential zones and average traffic moves at 45 to 60 mph. I plan to make regular trips from Las Vegas to Reno, Los Angeles, and probably an annual trip to Florida for Thanksgiving with family and the "Turkey Rod Run" in Daytona. I still need to be able to get stuck in traffic without the engine loading up. What parts will be best to finish off this combination and does anyone have any guesstimates of horsepower and torque/RPM at the flywheel? Thank you all for your patience and in advance for what I'm sure will be great replies. 
<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
gene (horseballz)------------------
'68 coupe
289/3speed(soon to
be 5.0/5speed)
'85 F150 Beater
300/Overdrive Stick
Pre-dented&scratched
'02 Ranger 4x4 Edge
'02 Miata
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Fastymz
Moderator Posts: 13447
From: Reno Nv USA MEM#1240
Registered: Apr 2001
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posted 03-16-2003 01:33 PM
I'm no expert but I'll put my .02 in any ways. 
I'd go with the 670 Avenger carb.It is a drivers carb,and still offers plenty of go.Pay attention to how you route your fuel line.Try to keep it away from any heat source.Also use a 4 hole 1" Phenolic carb spacer.Both will help to keep the fuel cooler for those real HOT days.
A guess of HP 300-340.
With that tire being about 27" tall and a 5spd.I'd go with a 3.55+ rear gears.------------------
SCOOP
oddly obsessed with big scoops on little Mustangs 2.26 60'S
14.9 @ 90.86MPH 65 coupe,351w,C4,Big Boss 429 hood scoop,8"3.40 TracLoc,Cragar SS,Black Suede. https://mustangsandmore.com/ubb/Fastymz.html
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 20735
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 03-16-2003 08:48 PM
For best performance a 700 DP Holley.
For the best of both worlds a 670 Avenger.
For best economy and least maintanance a 1.12 4100 series Autolite.------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
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johnmustang
Gearhead Posts: 4933
From: British Columbia , Canada
Registered: Nov 2001
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posted 03-16-2003 08:54 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Moneymaker:
For best economy and least maintanance a 1.12 4100 series Autolite.
HORSEBALLZ, If you have any interest I have an autolite 4100 1.12 venturi. I won,t be using it on my very mild street 289, I am using the autolite 4100 1.08. I will sell it if you want it, it does need a rebuild. JOHN ------------------
65 2+2 FASTBACK
87 TAURUS WAGON
98 F150 XLT TRITON V8 4.6, 4 WHEEL DRIVE
Member:Vancouver Island Mustang Association
M&M #1710
MyPhotoPage
MY TRUCK
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69 Sportsroof
Gearhead Posts: 1402
From: Valley, Alabama, USA
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 03-16-2003 09:48 PM
Double pumper with vacuum secondaries? Is there such an animal?
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 20735
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 03-17-2003 01:52 AM
NO!
Many enthusiasts refer to dual feeds as DP's for some reason.------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
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horseballz
Gearhead Posts: 216
From: LasVegas,NV
Registered: Dec 99
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posted 03-17-2003 02:25 AM
Please forgive my temporary lack of intelligence  . I do know the difference between a double pump (2- accelerator pumps) and simply a dual feed. Of course any idiot (me) should know that a double pumper would lose much of it's effectiveness if the secondaries were vacuum operated. 
On another note, how difficult is it to do a good rebuild on the 4100? I know that some carbs don't have all of the parts available to rebuild effectively. Most of my rebuilds have turned out great, but rottenchester 2 bbls never seem to come out right. Any tips or tricks would be appreciated. Also, what's the cfm on the 1.12 4100 Series Autolite?
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pony boy
Gearhead Posts: 347
From: n.y. n.y.
Registered: Jun 2000
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posted 03-19-2003 02:48 PM
Hey John,How much are looking for, for your carb? Email me a price when you get a chance,Thanks.
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69 Sportsroof
Gearhead Posts: 1402
From: Valley, Alabama, USA
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 03-19-2003 03:22 PM
quote:
Originally posted by horseballz:
On another note, how difficult is it to do a good rebuild on the 4100?
If it's anything like the 2300, it's a breeze. I didn't dip mine (probably should have) and used spray carb cleaner and brake cleaner on the ports and it works like a charm. Really easy to put back together.
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BornInAFord
Gearhead Posts: 248
From: Bend, OR, USA
Registered: Dec 2002
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posted 03-19-2003 04:01 PM
Pony Boy, I have a freshly rebuilt 4100 from a 1965 A-code MT I bought, but have no need for...It has been in dry storage since being rebuilt. I can get the numbers off the tag this evening. E-mail me if you are interested.[email protected] Daniel
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pony boy
Gearhead Posts: 347
From: n.y. n.y.
Registered: Jun 2000
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posted 03-20-2003 09:45 AM
Daniel, Email me the numbers and what you want for it when you get a chance,I don't care if it's rebuilt or not,I'm still going to go through it.I have my own tricks I do to them.Thanks,John when you get a chance please email me a price as well. My email is [email protected].
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Jeff
Gearhead Posts: 283
From: Moore, OK USA
Registered: Mar 2001
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posted 03-20-2003 02:42 PM
Street Avenger with vaccuum secondaries (570? or 670 cfm?)Street Avenger is a double pumper and it comes with all accessories built-in, no need to look for bits and pieces. I used the 570 on my '65 FRPP 302 and it gives good performance to 6000 rpm on Weiand Stealth dual plane manifold. If I were to consider the 670 then I'd look for a single plane manifold with as wide a power bandwidth as possible. In this you'll be trading off a small amount of low end torque for high end horsepower. I'm quite happy with the 570 and its a good all around carb. Both carbs have all needed ports and you won't need the factory spacer plate with port for power brakes. Mallory Distributor (no coil? or box? yet) With HO 5.0L roller you'll want Mallory 2770401 dual points or 4770401 Unilite. Dual points can be later converted to Unilite for $100. These are dual advance distributors (mechanical/vaccuum) that are best for street use. They come with the correct gear for use with the steel billet cams E303/B303. 277 is conventional and should be used with conventional or Mallory Non-Electronic coil. 477 is electronic and should be used Mallory electronic coil. Box? Hyfire is Mallory's box, it is multiple spark discharge like MSD's. Use only with electronic coils. Unilite triggers Hyfire in capacitive discharge mode. This produces longer, hotter spark than possible with conventional ignitions. Expect easier starting and smoother running with Hyfire than with conventional ignition. If you use Hyfire or MSD with Unilite then you need high voltage wiring, rotor and cap. If conventional then you can use standard furnished cap, rotor and 7mm wiring. I use the 2770401 Dual Points with Mallory conventional coil, and 8mm Mallory Sidewinder wiring set. Works fine. I only occasionally drive my car so its great. If I were daily driving I'd go with the Hyfire/MSD set up. Ford "Mustang Powered by FORD" aluminum valve covers.Will I have problems with these due to the Ford roller rockers? I tried the Scott Drake Mustang "Powered By Ford" and they won't work even with stock GT40 rockers. The Ford version is better since the baffles are better shaped but my guess is they won't fit. I think you will need the taller, more square "Ford Racing" polished aluminum or chromed covers. These are very nice and work well with the steel/rubber reusable gaskets. These gaskets beat cork or neoprene gaskets hands down. I bolt my covers down with chrome bolts obtained from Harley shop. I also use R&M specialties billet looms for the wires. These come with plastic standoffs - I've swapped the plastic standoffs for aluminum standoffs since the plastic tends to break when the covers are torqued down. I can get these bolts with Harley skull and crossbones etched into the heads... I have no problems whatsoever with the car/engine being contankerous. It idles down reasonably smoothly at 650 rpm (lopes a bit) and is responsive to the throttle. Only complaint is fast idle is a bit too high and fixed (non-adjustable). Once its out of fast idle it is well behaved throughout the throttle range. I use with T5 and 3.50 gears. Rear is held in reasonable alignment with Shelby-style underride traction bars. Suspension is stiff (30-420 variable coils, GT rear suspension).
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Ryan Wilke
Gearhead Posts: 1644
From: Stanton, Michigan 49707
Registered: Oct 2000
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posted 03-20-2003 05:35 PM
quote:
Originally posted by horseballz:
......what's the cfm on the 1.12 4100 Series Autolite?
Gene,
The "1.08" Autolite carb is the somewhat rare 485-cfm carb and the "1.12" is the more common 600-cfm carb. Good Luck!
Ryan
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 20735
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 03-20-2003 07:09 PM
1.08 is 480 CFM.  ------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,&'03
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
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BornInAFord
Gearhead Posts: 248
From: Bend, OR, USA
Registered: Dec 2002
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posted 03-20-2003 07:28 PM
Wasn't the 1.08 (480CFM) the A and K code (non-Shelby) carb for the small-block, and the 1.12 (600CFM) the S code (and larger) FE's?Daniel
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BornInAFord
Gearhead Posts: 248
From: Bend, OR, USA
Registered: Dec 2002
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posted 03-20-2003 07:45 PM
I take that back... IF I remember correctly, the K code had 1.12 venturis and manual choke.Daniel
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