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Author Topic:   1969 BOSS 429
johnmustang
Gearhead

Posts: 5818
From: British Columbia , Canada
Registered: Nov 2001

posted 09-27-2002 03:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for johnmustang   Click Here to Email johnmustang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just finished talking with one of my clients in Kansas , and , he was telling me about his 69 boss 429, it is all original , untouched , it is green , 4sp , matching #`s , he apparently also has the original rubber for the car. As well as all the paper work for the car , it has 92,000 miles on it , but , is starting to smoke a little bit. He wants to know what the value of the car is , I told him $35,000.00 to $50,000.00 U.S. funds , but , I also told him it was just a guess. What do you think the value would be ?

He also has a 1965 427 SOHC all aluminum. He said it was called a " Cammer " , I have heard of the " NASS " , but , not the cammer, he is selling it , and , wants $28,000.00 U.S. funds. Does this sound about right or is it way out of line. I really don,t know so that is why I am asking you. Look forward to reading your responses.

JOHN

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65 2+2 FASTBACK
68 COUPE
87 TAURUS WAGON
98 F150 XLT TRITON V8 4.6, 4 WHEEL DRIVE
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mustangzrule
Journeyman

Posts: 87
From: Orion, MI
Registered: Sep 2002

posted 09-27-2002 03:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mustangzrule   Click Here to Email mustangzrule     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Some people have all the luck. Both pieces would make any Blue Oval fanantic drool. That "cammer" is a single overhead cam (SOHC) big block engine. ~750HP.

Prices are about right, maybe a little high. Depends on condition and the mood of the buyer.

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Fastback68
Gearhead

Posts: 3053
From: Sucat, Paranaque, Philippines
Registered: Jul 99

posted 09-28-2002 12:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Fastback68   Click Here to Email Fastback68     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
For Boss 429's, you have an international market, so you can shoot for higher prices than I think you can get in North America. I've seen a couple for sale in the $50,000 range in the UK, but they had both been restored. Of course, I don't know if they actually sold for that price.
Now if it's never been restored and is rust-free, etc., etc., you can go after the concours market, which must add 20% (?) to the value.
That said, I honestly don't know if there are concours fanatics for Stangs in Europe like you have in the US.
Idle thoughts only Way out of my league, sadly!
Simon

[This message has been edited by Fastback68 (edited 09-28-2002).]

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Fastymz
Moderator

Posts: 18590
From: Reno Nv USA MEM#1240
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 09-28-2002 07:36 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Fastymz   Click Here to Email Fastymz     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by 66MustangGTCoupe289:
i just feel like being a jackass right now

Brandon


Right now, ,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,,

SCOOP

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2.634 60's
[email protected] 1/8 mile

65 coupe,351w,C4,Big Boss 429 hood scoop,8"3.40 TracLoc,Cragar SS,Black Suede.

https://mustangsandmore.com/ubb/Fastymz.html

[This message has been edited by Fastymz (edited 09-28-2002).]

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Allstock&500hp
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Posts: 10
From: miami
Registered: Sep 2002

posted 09-28-2002 10:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Allstock&500hp   Click Here to Email Allstock&500hp     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
the cammers came in the drag pak cars.like the falcon with the "teardrop" hood. looks pretty sweet, i saw one in a car show all orginal, with the head lights removed and replaced with air ducts, and gutted from the factory. looked like it weighed 2500 lbs. haha

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jsracingbbf
Gearhead

Posts: 2740
From: Batesville,MS. , U.S.A.
Registered: Mar 2002

posted 09-29-2002 12:05 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for jsracingbbf   Click Here to Email jsracingbbf     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I've heard it said that the Cammers (SOHC, so named for the single overhead cams in each valve cover) would be in TOP FUEL cars now if Ford would have helped with support or allowed aftermarket stuff to be manufactured for them. I don't know for sure. Looking back through the old HOT ROD books it seems the cammers won more races in the A/FX wars, when they stayed together. In an Interview Dyno Don swears he could ALWAYS beat the Mopars if he could get the SOHC to live all day. I also read once where Holman & Moody were trying to develop a timing belt for the motor instead of a chain way back in the days when it would have helped. I think Ford decided to lean towards NASCAR, big suprise. So now Force runs a HEMI clone in his Mustang. I've never heard of a all aluminum Cammer, I wonder where it originated? Any History given on it JOHN?
Jerry

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johnmustang
Gearhead

Posts: 5818
From: British Columbia , Canada
Registered: Nov 2001

posted 09-29-2002 01:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for johnmustang   Click Here to Email johnmustang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by jsracingbbf:
I've heard it said that the Cammers (SOHC, so named for the single overhead cams in each valve cover) would be in TOP FUEL cars now if Ford would have helped with support or allowed aftermarket stuff to be manufactured for them. I don't know for sure. Looking back through the old HOT ROD books it seems the cammers won more races in the A/FX wars, when they stayed together. In an Interview Dyno Don swears he could ALWAYS beat the Mopars if he could get the SOHC to live all day. I also read once where Holman & Moody were trying to develop a timing belt for the motor instead of a chain way back in the days when it would have helped. I think Ford decided to lean towards NASCAR, big suprise. So now Force runs a HEMI clone in his Mustang. I've never heard of a all aluminum Cammer, I wonder where it originated? Any History given on it JOHN?
Jerry

No history given , but , I will call Mark , and , ask him to send me as much info as I can. As soon as I get whatever he sends to me I will post it here for you

JOHN

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65 2+2 FASTBACK
68 COUPE
87 TAURUS WAGON
98 F150 XLT TRITON V8 4.6, 4 WHEEL DRIVE
Member:Vancouver Island Mustang Association
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albatross
Journeyman

Posts: 28
From: NZ
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 10-21-2002 12:14 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for albatross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ford made a 494" SOHC all ali engine to run in Cam Am in the late 1960's early 1970's I think

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Rory McNeil
Gearhead

Posts: 1536
From: Surrey, B.C. Canada
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 10-21-2002 01:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rory McNeil   Click Here to Email Rory McNeil     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I`ve seen several 427SOHC "Cammers" over the years. Everyone I seen had a cast iron block, some with aluminum heads, most with cast iron.
The "Drag Pack" cars were first given that designation in 1969, for the 428 SUPER Cobra Jet Mustangs, Cougars,Cyclone & Fairlane/Torino`s.The Drag Pack package on the 428 CJ mainly consisted of the "LeMans" capscrew connecting rods, & because of their extra weight, a differently counterweighted crankshaft,flywheel, & harmonic balancer/spacer was used to make up for the heavier rods. An engine oil cooler was also used. The Drag Pack was specified when either the 3.91 or 4.30 rear end ratio`s wereinstalled. In the Boss 302 Mustangs & Cougars & 429 SCJ 70-71 Torino/Cyclones, & 71 Mustang/Cougars, the low gears got you the oilcooler, & on the 429`s the solid lifter cam, & 780 Holley.
Also, the 494" Can Am engine was based on the Boss 429 engine, NOT the 427 SOHC, FE engine.
A 90,000 mile Boss 429 is extremely unusual, as these engines tended to have many problems, fairly early in life. Most that have over about 35,000 miles seem to have had many engine repairs, or piled up the mileage with less exotic, more reliable powerplants. About 10 years ago, a buddy purchased a Grabber blue 70 Boss 429 Mustang from the original owner. The car had spend most of the prevoius years sitting in storage, due to a loud engine knock. With 32,000 original miles, my buddy pulled the engine apart, to discover a broken piston skirt, similar to the common Boss 302 pistons. Since the engine was so nice inside, he bought an NOS piston, and freshened up the engine. The previous owner had every reciept from day 1, & it appears that this Boss had several expensive repairs through out the 70`s, due to oil & coolant leaks from the "O" ringed heads & block. (Boss 429`s didn`t use head gaskets). After doing a really nice resto on this car, The engine came out twice in the first year back on the road, as oil & coolant leaks were still occuring. Finding these O ring sets was very expensive from Steve Strange, & my buddy eventually sold the car to a local Ford collector & Pro Mod racer. My buddy wanted to be able to DRIVE this Mustang, but he was not content to leave puddles on the ground when he parked it, so it went to live in a nice retirement in a large museum like barn.This car had never been raced or"Hot rodded" & other than the smog pump, every correctly numbered part was still on the car.Still it had a lot of engine problems. I have seen several other Boss 429`s at shows, & everyone that was driven was a "leaker". Too bad, as having one to just put on display at car shows seems such a waste.

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78 Fairmont 428 4 speed [email protected]
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Mpcoluv
Gearhead

Posts: 1271
From: Charlotte NC usa
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 10-21-2002 06:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mpcoluv   Click Here to Email Mpcoluv     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by albatross:
Ford made a 494" SOHC all ali engine to run in Cam Am in the late 1960's early 1970's I think

The 494 was a Boss 429 type of motor.
Aluminum block with giant bore....
Holman-Moody had one of those engines in their shop last year.

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albatross
Journeyman

Posts: 28
From: NZ
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 10-21-2002 07:31 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for albatross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ok, I'm new at all this so someone can correct me. The FE block 427 SOHC came out in late '65 and went through until '68 as an over the counter motor that wasn't sold in any road cars. A/FX cars were running them shoehorned into the '65 and '66 mustangs. And then in '67 the '427 came out in the Mustang, so there could be some '67 Mustangs out there that had the 427 SOHC motor fitted aftermarket?

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Mpcoluv
Gearhead

Posts: 1271
From: Charlotte NC usa
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 10-21-2002 09:57 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mpcoluv   Click Here to Email Mpcoluv     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by albatross:
Ok, I'm new at all this so someone can correct me. The FE block 427 SOHC came out in late '65 and went through until '68 as an over the counter motor that wasn't sold in any road cars. A/FX cars were running them shoehorned into the '65 and '66 mustangs. And then in '67 the '427 came out in the Mustang, so there could be some '67 Mustangs out there that had the 427 SOHC motor fitted aftermarket?

You whould have to hack the towers to get a cammer in any mustang with the exception of a (factory hacked) Boss 429 chassis.
Holman-Moody sold some flat shock towers that allowed the cammer to be installed in mustangs I think....

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 25539
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 10-21-2002 10:36 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yes Holman and Moody sold and installed bolt in widened shock towers for 65-66 Mustangs to accomodate FE's and cammers. Cammers were installed by FoMoCo factory authorized "agents" or sub-contractors in everything from an all fiberglass 65 Falcon, to a 66 Galaxie for "FX" competition.

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Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
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Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
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Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"

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albatross
Journeyman

Posts: 28
From: NZ
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 10-21-2002 10:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for albatross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Reason that I ask is that I'm looking for a mustang project to get underway in 10 months or so. Happy to budget around $10,000-$20,000 (slush fund - money accumulated prior to wife) to get it in the garage and then whatever. I like the '69 Boss 302 and think the Shelbys and Boss 429 are way out of my league - and then there's the finding a resto car.

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johnmustang
Gearhead

Posts: 5818
From: British Columbia , Canada
Registered: Nov 2001

posted 10-22-2002 12:07 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for johnmustang   Click Here to Email johnmustang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by albatross:
Reason that I ask is that I'm looking for a mustang project to get underway in 10 months or so. Happy to budget around $10,000-$20,000 (slush fund - money accumulated prior to wife) to get it in the garage and then whatever. I like the '69 Boss 302 and think the Shelbys and Boss 429 are way out of my league - and then there's the finding a resto car.

10 - 20k will put one he!! of a project into your garage. Check around , with that kind of money there are alot of nice stangs to be had.

JOHN

------------------
65 2+2 FASTBACK
68 COUPE (SOLD)
87 TAURUS WAGON
98 F150 XLT TRITON V8 4.6, 4 WHEEL DRIVE
Member:Vancouver Island Mustang Association
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albatross
Journeyman

Posts: 28
From: NZ
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 10-23-2002 11:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for albatross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Haven't read too much about the cammers except for in my Pat Ganahl book where he states relatively few Boss 429s exist in comparison to the cammers of which there are a few about. Which has me confused as I don't think I've seen a single SOHC 427 for sale yet but I've come across about a dozen Boss 429 Mustangs.

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Mpcoluv
Gearhead

Posts: 1271
From: Charlotte NC usa
Registered: Apr 2001

posted 10-23-2002 11:42 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Mpcoluv   Click Here to Email Mpcoluv     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by albatross:
Haven't read too much about the cammers except for in my Pat Ganahl book where he states relatively few Boss 429s exist in comparison to the cammers of which there are a few about. Which has me confused as I don't think I've seen a single SOHC 427 for sale yet but I've come across about a dozen Boss 429 Mustangs.

A older guy had a 427 SOHC for sale at the Charlotte spring swap meet about 3 or 4 years ago for $12K...Too bad it won't easily fit into any car I have (or my budget).
Alan Root used to make repro and race oriented Boss 429 heads, and I think Blue Thunder still makes the heads, intakes and valvecovers. I believe they will fit on a modified 460 block. Some sort of oil supply/drain mods have to be made IIRC.....

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DidgeyTrucker
Gearhead

Posts: 1144
From: Greenbrier, TN USA
Registered: Oct 99

posted 10-26-2002 04:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for DidgeyTrucker   Click Here to Email DidgeyTrucker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
According to what I've read over the past 25 years or so....
The 427 Single OverHead Cam engine was designed to compete on the NASCAR circuit to compete against the Chrysler 426 Hemi. It was first seen in a 1964 Galaxie at the Indianapolis Motor Speedway. NASCAR said "no" so Ford made the engine available to drag racers. Holman Moody built about six 1965 Mustangs in 1965 outfitted with 2x4V gas burning cammers. Holman Moody built six "long nose" Mustangs with Hilborn injected nitro burning cammers in 1966. Ford also sold the engines to AA/Fuel racers who ran them supercharged. The carbureted gas burning cammers in the A/FX classes were more successful than the supercharged nitro burning motors. The side-oiler 427 block was specially cast in cast iron with an extra oil return passage for the cammer heads.

The 494 was a special CanAm motor based on the 429/460 series. I've seen one with wedge heads in a 1970 King Cobra Torino.

$28,000 seems a little high for the cammer. I see them in Hemmings for less than that.

Tracy

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Visit my Web site: DidgeyTrucker's Website

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 25539
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 10-26-2002 05:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Several induction systems were available for the 427 SOHC.
180 degree 2 4v
360 degree 2 4v
4 Webers
180 degree 1 4v (Nascar and street proposal)
Hilborn Port fuel injection
Conolec electromechanical fuel injection

I miss Fords Total Performance years.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
MCA member# 53321
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00, '01, & '02
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"

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albatross
Journeyman

Posts: 28
From: NZ
Registered: Sep 2001

posted 10-30-2002 01:28 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for albatross     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Found this great photo of the A/FX cammer cars being built on the Holman Moody website:
http://www.holmanmoody.com/images/drag_racing/AFXstang4.jpg

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