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Author Topic:   Intake or camshaft, what next?
cpmaverick
Gearhead

Posts: 1602
From: Auburn, AL.
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 10-28-2001 08:13 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cpmaverick   Click Here to Email cpmaverick     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I went to the track Friday and turned a [email protected] I think I can probably pull a 12.8 or so out of this car before I modify more. Here's my setup:

1970 Maverick ~2800 lbs
1987 5.0L HO
-Weiand Stealth
-Holley 650 DP
-B303 roller cam
-1.7:1 roller rockers
-milled block, ~10.2:1
-stock bottom end, stock pistons (forged TRWs are OEM)
-E7TE heads, ported with GT40 valvetrain
-no-name headers

My question is, what is holding me back the most? I think my combo is pretty well matched (I planned it that way). But of course I'd like to go faster. I'm pondering a single plane intake or a bigger cam. Of course I may run into valve/piston issues with more lift. Any other ideas? Heads? Is a 650 too small? It improved power a lot over my 600.

------------------
-Charlie Ping
1970 Maverick Grabber
[email protected]
Daily Driver
http://www.maverickgrabber.com

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capri man
Gearhead

Posts: 4320
From: doerun, ga.
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 10-28-2001 08:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for capri man   Click Here to Email capri man     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
what rear end do you have? and what gears? posi? ready to go back to r-j t-bones?

------------------
mike r
racing is real
everything else is just a game.
81 capri-7.56 @88mph 1/8
1.56 60 ft.

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 1805
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 10-28-2001 11:03 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Your combo sounds really well balanced. You're not going to get any huge gains from the engine. The cam is sort of generic, but with the 1.7 rockers, should work fine. You might gain a little by going with a more up-to-date split pattern unit... but I have a feeling the gain would be minimal.

If you do get a new cam, make sure the valvesprings are up to the task. A modern cam, such as the Extreme Energy line from Comp Cams already has over 0.500" with 1.6 rockers. You can see the specs of these cams at the following link. The XE268 would be a nice unit (224/230), the XE274 (230/236) might be a bit large unless you've got a fairly loose converter and plenty of gear.

http://www.compcams.com/catalog/146_147.html

Checking the rocker geometry is MANDATORY for good guide life!!!

Personally, I believe you'll find more ET in the rest of your drivetrain. The engine sounds about right. The 650DP is all you need. I gained nothing on my when going from my modified 650DP to a 750 Speed Demon. If you want to try an inexpensive experiment, you could get than Pro-Form main body. It is supposed to be a quality unit, and it's price just dropped to $99 at Jegs!

I see you run a 4-speed and 3.70 rear gear. Steeper gears than that can help at the track (if you've got slicks or ET-Streets) but are a pain on the street without overdrive.

Speaking of that... what tires are you running at the track? If you don't have a set of slicks already, I'd buy a set. A set of 26x8.5 MT ET Drags would be plenty. Don't go any larger than that with your car. You can fit them on either 15x7 or 15x8 wheels. They also sell that size slick in a 14" rim size, which gives a little more sidewall... which would work well. I don't know if a 14" rim would clear your disk brakes though...

If you don't have them already, slicks will put you where you want to be... solidly in the 12's! They are my recommended next purchase!

Good Luck!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367

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cpmaverick
Gearhead

Posts: 1602
From: Auburn, AL.
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 10-28-2001 11:51 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cpmaverick   Click Here to Email cpmaverick     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for the responses, keep 'em coming.

Some things I should have mentioned-

4-speed, 3.70:1 9" traction-lok
The car is my daily driver and the only car I own (but I drive it every day with 90-10s so drivability isn't a big concern )
I am currently running BFG drag radials 275-50-15 and my best 60' is a 1.93 which can be improved.

Hmmmm looks like my worst fears are realized I have built a well balanced street car but now I want to improve and don't have much room.

I have a friend with a 700 DP I can try. And I'm sure I can get a 12 with my current combo, my last run was a 13.07 and my previous 3 runs were 13.54, 13.32, 13.23 (all bests at the time). The track closed on my rapidly improving times.

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MrWesson22
Gearhead

Posts: 1212
From: Dacula, GA
Registered: Sep 2000

posted 10-29-2001 06:00 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for MrWesson22   Click Here to Email MrWesson22     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Looks like it's either time to tear into that shortblock or get forced induction. Used 331cid or 347cid short blocks/long blocks are for sale all the time from 5.0 racers for usually very reasonable prices. Since it's a daily driver, you could always turn to the blue bottle. As far as not going under the hood, get slicks - one other option would be going to a 5 speed. It'll give you the best of both worlds - a deeper first gear for quicker launches and overdrive. Of course, with the overdrive, you could use more gear as well if you so choose.

------------------
Neal
Member #723
[email protected] AIM: MrWesson22

69 Gulfstream Aqua Grande
351C/Toploader 4sp

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capri man
Gearhead

Posts: 4320
From: doerun, ga.
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 10-29-2001 08:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for capri man   Click Here to Email capri man     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
good morning charlie, a little more gear would probably help but since it is your daily driver you really dont need any more. have you thought about getting an extra set of wheels and mounting a set of slicks on them. an inch shorter tire will make a few points differenge in your final gear ratio. is there anywhere that you could lose some weight? (alum, bumper etc.) lighter wheels? you know they say that 100lbs = 1/10 in et.

------------------
mike r
racing is real
everything else is just a game.
81 capri-7.56 @88mph 1/8
1.56 60 ft.

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7DMACH1
Gearhead

Posts: 1766
From: PHILA. PA.
Registered: Feb 2001

posted 10-29-2001 09:40 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for 7DMACH1   Click Here to Email 7DMACH1     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Your 60ft time is what need to be improved. I have a 86 5.0 Capri that was running 13.04 with 187 60 ft times. I did nothing to the engine but improved the suspension. If you don't have frame ties get them. What kind of rear shocks are you running. Gas pressurized shocks don't plant the rear. Do you have any kind of traction bars? I run 26x8.5 street slicks and 3.73 gears. It a stick that I launch at 5800rpm. My 60 ft times went from 187 to 165 and my et went to 12.86 at 107 mph just from frame ties, shocks, springs, Southside bars. RAY

------------------
RAY . FLY THE FLAG, SHOW THE WORLD WE ARE PROUD AMERICANS!70 MACH 1 351C NOW 408 STROKER 4SPD.
86 MERCURY CAPRI 5.0 RUNS 12.86 @107 1.65 60 ft.
2001 LINCOLN LS V8 1997 MUSTANG
SHOW THE WORLD, LIGHT A CANDLE.
http://www.geocities.com/slariviere/7DMach1.html

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cpmaverick
Gearhead

Posts: 1602
From: Auburn, AL.
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 10-29-2001 01:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cpmaverick   Click Here to Email cpmaverick     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Yeah, I realize I can probably pull a 1.8 with the BFGs now. I am running cheapo Lakewood traction bars; I have 90-10 shocks in the front but my rears are gas, (back from the days I wanted a good ride )

Subframe connectors would probably be a great idea.

I have thought about running a smaller rear tire in a slick, but right now its pretty cost prohibitive.

I think I'd break a T-5 5-speed, and anything else is out of my price range right now.

My car is pretty light, except for drivetrain which I built for durability. I have light wheels. Of course I could remove my AC I guess but it is a light GM compressor mounted custom down low (not the old Ford Style).

I'll probably relocate my battery to the trunk, get some subframe connectors and work on my 60' some more. Then I'll look into a real set of slicks.

Those are some insane 60' times Ray, I didn't think those were possible with this kind of HP. Now I have something to shoot for. Should I get some dedicated race shocks rear or will regular shocks work nearly as well?

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7DMACH1
Gearhead

Posts: 1766
From: PHILA. PA.
Registered: Feb 2001

posted 10-29-2001 02:04 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 7DMACH1   Click Here to Email 7DMACH1     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I bought the cheapest oil filled shock I think they were Gabriel Red Riders. I also put 4cly springs in the back so the car squars. The front is all original except I removed the front sway bar and my battery is still up front. I launch the car at 5800 and shift at 5800. The only time I had trouble with the trans was shifting without fully depressing the clutch, I broke 3rd gear and destroyed the cluster gear. As long as I push the clutch I haven't had a problem. Don't be afraid to launch it at 5800, it loves it with that 335 first and 3.73's I've put 4.10's in now but have not had it to the track. The reason I did that was because I was only spinning 5100 thru the traps. Now it's launch and shift. RAY

------------------
RAY . FLY THE FLAG, SHOW THE WORLD WE ARE PROUD AMERICANS!70 MACH 1 351C NOW 408 STROKER 4SPD.
86 MERCURY CAPRI 5.0 RUNS 12.86 @107 1.65 60 ft.
2001 LINCOLN LS V8 1997 MUSTANG
SHOW THE WORLD, LIGHT A CANDLE.
http://www.geocities.com/slariviere/7DMach1.html

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 1805
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 10-29-2001 05:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You might want to get the 26x8.5 MT slick that uses a 14" rim. This will have more sidewall than the 15" unit... and will wrinkle down to a smaller diameter upon launch. The extra sidewall height will also absorb more shock.

A five speed conversion would also be great. A tremec swap would be nice if you don't trust the strength of T5. The price difference isn't that much. The Tremec mounts using a 79-84 mustang SROD bellhousing. You just have rig up the cable clutch and you'll probably need to use a diaphragem clutch and flywheel. www.fordmuscle.com diagrams this swap in their archives. The Tremec has a 3.27 first gear.

Good Luck!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 1805
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 10-29-2001 05:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here ya' go... This is a guy off the fordnatics mailing list. He's honest, and just placed the ad today. You might even talk him down a bit. Get it while the gettin's good.

Tremec 3550 trans for sale. Excellent condition, stepping up to a TKO. This trans will be shipped with
the GM synchromesh fluid already in it because I put new fluid in less than 1K miles ago. No shifting
problems when removed. 850 shipped to your door in the lower 48.

Mike
[email protected]

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367

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cpmaverick
Gearhead

Posts: 1602
From: Auburn, AL.
Registered: Jan 2000

posted 10-29-2001 11:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cpmaverick   Click Here to Email cpmaverick     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Damn, I wish I had the money for that tranny but it will be a few months before I can come up with that.

If I had a 5-speed I'd go 4.62 rear gears. I couldn't help myself

[This message has been edited by cpmaverick (edited 10-29-2001).]

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