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Author Topic:   1959 9" rear with 2.91 gears?
68 S-code GT
Gearhead

Posts: 1199
From: Sayreville, NJ, US
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 09-09-2003 05:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 68 S-code GT   Click Here to Email 68 S-code GT     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I have a 9” rear with 2.91 gears in it out of a 59 Edsel. What can someone tell me about it? Could it have limited slip? Bearing size (big or small)? How many splines would be on the axle? Also what is the bolt pattern for the wheels?

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Ed S.

68 S-code FB GT 4spd(now C6)/3.25 PS PDB
68 J-code(now 289) Cp Sprint"B" C4/3L00-9" PDB PS AC
99 F150 XLT Ext/cab, 4X4, 5.4L, 3L55
95 Exploder XLT with the works! (Wife's car)

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68 S-code GT
Gearhead

Posts: 1199
From: Sayreville, NJ, US
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 09-09-2003 10:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 68 S-code GT   Click Here to Email 68 S-code GT     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I think the car had a 400+ CI engine and the axles aren't tapered, well at least the tubes aren't

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Ed S.

68 S-code FB GT 4spd(now C6)/3.25 PS PDB
68 J-code(now 289) Cp Sprint"B" C4/3L00-9" PDB PS AC
99 F150 XLT Ext/cab, 4X4, 5.4L, 3L55
03 Winstar Limited with the works! (Wife's car)

[This message has been edited by 68 S-code GT (edited 09-10-2003).]

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KULTULZ
Gearhead

Posts: 384
From: Rockville, MD
Registered: Oct 2002

posted 09-10-2003 12:40 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for KULTULZ   Click Here to Email KULTULZ     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The 1959 EDSEL used the inline six, Y-BLOCK (292) and FE (332/361) that year for power.

The MEL 410ci. was dropped after 1958. The rear you have will be the same used on the 1959 FORD line most likely. It will have the small bearing (the wagon/taxi and police had the larger bearing) and is most likely 28 spline.

Is the I.D. tag still on it? If so, it might not be listed under FORD cataloging and require an EDSEL parts catalog to fully I.D. it.

Easiest thing to do is pull an axle and check for taper and spline count.

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I am looking for information concerning factory performance/aftermarket speed parts (1958/1960) used on the MEL (Mercury-Edsel-Lincoln) (Also Thunderbird 59/60) Engine Series (383-410-430-462) produced from 1958 thru 1968.

Also older FORD Special Service Tools

-MEL Engine Forum-

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Rory McNeil
Gearhead

Posts: 1271
From: Surrey, B.C. Canada
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 09-10-2003 01:38 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rory McNeil   Click Here to Email Rory McNeil     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
As noted, the Station Wagons had the larger axle bearings, easiest way to tell is with the size of the nuts on the axle retaining plates. The small bearing regular cars use a 9/16`s socket, while the SW`s are 3/4". The 2.91 ratio was a regular ratio, most likely with a FE V8 & automatic. The wheel bolt pattern would be reg. Ford 5 on 4 1/2". Although a "limited slip" diff is shown in my 1959 Ford shop manual, I have yet to see a 59 Ford or Edsel so equipped from the factory.

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78 Fairmont 428 4 speed [email protected]
80 Fairmont 302 5 speed [email protected]
85 Mustang NHRA Stocker 302 5speed. [email protected]
59 Meteor (Canadian Ford) 2 dr sedan 332, auto
74 F350 ramp truck 390 4spd

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68 S-code GT
Gearhead

Posts: 1199
From: Sayreville, NJ, US
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 09-10-2003 07:53 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for 68 S-code GT   Click Here to Email 68 S-code GT     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
There is a tag but all is says is 2.91. As far as the bolt pattern goes, the standard Mustang rim (4 ½” I think) is too small. That’s why I’m asking a lot of stupid questions about it. I’m just trying to flood my head with a bunch of possibilities so I don’t over look anything. If I turn the pinion gear will both axles turn in the same direction if it’s a lim-slip or is it if I turn one axle the other will turn in the same direction? I looked into the fill hole and it looks like a 5/8 bolt with a washer but there is no machined counter sink on the spool. I plan on opening it up but now I have to barrow a puller for the axles. My planes on using the poor mans puller (a brake drum) died when I couldn’t get the Mustang wheel to bolt up. I'll have to check those retainer nut when I get home.

[This message has been edited by 68 S-code GT (edited 09-10-2003).]

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KULTULZ
Gearhead

Posts: 384
From: Rockville, MD
Registered: Oct 2002

posted 09-10-2003 06:16 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for KULTULZ   Click Here to Email KULTULZ     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
If the tag reads 2.91, then it is an open rear (as assembled). If locking, it would read 2L91. That is not to say that someone hasn't added Equa or Traction-Loc at some point. If the rear end asm is definitly from an EDSEL, the 1958 EDSEL was built on a FORD platform and also a MERCURY platform. I don't have MERCURY info here as the MERC bolt pattern may have been wider (4 3/4"?). This may have been carried over. This is just conjecture. One would need the MERC-EDSEL MPC (Master Parts Catalog) to ascertain just exactly what you have.

I think it is going to come down to tearing it apart and IDing individual pieces. It is hard to say how many times it has been into since 1958.

-Measuring Wheel Bolt Pattern Size-

------------------
I am looking for information concerning factory performance/aftermarket speed parts (1958/1960) used on the MEL (Mercury-Edsel-Lincoln) (Also Thunderbird 59/60) Engine Series (383-410-430-462) produced from 1958 thru 1968.

Also older FORD Special Service Tools

-MEL Engine Forum-

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68 S-code GT
Gearhead

Posts: 1199
From: Sayreville, NJ, US
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 09-10-2003 09:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 68 S-code GT   Click Here to Email 68 S-code GT     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ok, this is what I found when I pulled it apart.

1. 28 spline axles
2. The center case has WAB 4025A cast into it
3.The spool has WAM 4205 on one side and WAM 4206A on the other.
4.The ring gear has WAM 4210 B a star and then 43 21C SHIFT 2.
5.It ring gear to spool bolts have 5/8” heads and washers.
6.The spool looks like the standard open with no counter sunk or machined out spots for the bolt heads.
7.Flange or retainer bolts have ¾” nuts and are approximately 3 ½” on center from left to right.
8.Backing plates measure 12” across.

Car was a 59 Edsel with E-4XX engine from what i remember was on the valve covers. I can't remember if it was 2 or 4 doors but it definitely wasn’t a wagon. I do remember that the thing looked massive!

What can you guys tell me with this information?

[This message has been edited by 68 S-code GT (edited 09-10-2003).]

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KULTULZ
Gearhead

Posts: 384
From: Rockville, MD
Registered: Oct 2002

posted 09-11-2003 08:49 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for KULTULZ   Click Here to Email KULTULZ     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
OK...

There were two EDSEL Engine Series;

E-400 Which was a 361 FE...

E-475 Which was a 410 MEL...

Supposedly, the 410 was discontinued after the 1958 production run. The 361 was carried over to 1959.

I have no MERCURY-EDSEL-LINCOLN parts information and only go back to 1960 on FORD (Which will change soon hopefully).

I have a 1958 MERCURY Shop Manual and it shows the bolt pattern on the MERC as being 5". Most likely this was carried to the EDSEL chassis.

I am fairly certain that what you have is a FORD 9" assembly with a larger wheel bolt pattern on the axle flanges with the larger bearings. I cannot for certain verify this until I obtain the MERCURY MPC. The above is only conjecture on my part.

If the flange to flange width is correct for retrofit into a MUSTANG chassis (and it is not that difficlut to narrow axle tubes), most likey one can find a set of FORD axles (or have those flanges redrilled) with the correct bolt pattern.

I hope this has helped some.

-Axle End Mearurements-

(Go to page 68 in their catalog and it will give a chart with axle housing end measurements)

If I can help (or hurt) any further, please ask.

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I am looking for information concerning factory performance/aftermarket speed parts (1958/1960) used on the MEL (Mercury-Edsel-Lincoln) (Also Thunderbird 59/60) Engine Series (383-410-430-462) produced from 1958 thru 1968.

Also older FORD Special Service Tools

-MEL Engine Forum-

[This message has been edited by KULTULZ (edited 09-11-2003).]

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