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Author Topic:   bush targets Google
mellowyellow
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From: So. Fl.
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posted 01-20-2006 09:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mellowyellow     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Furthur chiseling away at Constitutional Rights: The bush gang is now targeting Google, under the guise of protecting children from pornography. They want access to Google's database. Not being able to use the right terminology, paraphrase: the news report states that they want to get into the "mechanics" of the operation, ultimately leading to the users of Google. First wire tapping, now internet tapping. Is the 2nd ammendment far behind? He talked about "taking a look at that" once, also.

Faced with bigger world problems that are of major importance to the welfare of our country, they focus on this.

The Supreme Court has dealt with this issue before, and Google's refusal was upheld once before. Yahoo allegedly complied with this demand. Microsoft has made no statement. So, the new attorney general is trying a different approach to "get into the net"!

This is not a matter of being liberal or conservative, it's a bigger matter of being RADICAL! Dictionary Definition: "One who wants to make 'fundamental' changes, as in government or society!. Bawdy Shop beware??


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adragon8u
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posted 01-20-2006 09:21 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for adragon8u   Click Here to Email adragon8u     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ever see this? It's funny.
http://politicalhumor.about.com/od/funnyvideos/v/bushdrunk.htm

------------------
"It's better to have loved a short girl,
Then never to have loved a tall"
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beachbum
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posted 01-20-2006 11:10 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for beachbum     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't want to get into a political arugement but calling our President and his staff a gang shows a lot of disrespect to our President and the country.

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mellowyellow
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posted 01-20-2006 12:38 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mellowyellow     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by beachbum:
calling our President and his staff a gang shows a lot of disrespect to our President and the country.


I capitalize my Country out of respect.
Respect my Country as much as anyone! Will gladly put my ethics and feelings for my Country up against the following any day, any time!

Respect for:
Tom Delay. Bill Frist, Scooter Libby, Karl Rove, Dick Cheney and his Halliburton Billions and secret energy committee, and george bush himself. I don't think so!

Try not to make a habit of posting lies. Can the above make that statement?

[This message has been edited by mellowyellow (edited 01-20-2006).]

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beachbum
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posted 01-20-2006 12:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for beachbum     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
As I said before I don't want to get into a political arguement with anyone, I just formed an opinion from what I read, so be it.

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SUBMARINER MUSTANGER
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From: Grandview, Missouri
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posted 01-20-2006 01:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SUBMARINER MUSTANGER   Click Here to Email SUBMARINER MUSTANGER     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mellowyellow:
under the guise of protecting children from pornography.


I don't get it. President Bush, and his "gang" want to do something to clean up the internet pornography PROBLEM, and you have a problem with it??

If Google, or any other internet entity is making it easier for children to post, access, make or do ANYTHING with pornography, MORE POWER to President Bush and his gang to do whatever is necessary to stop it, or at least put a dent in it!! What do you mean by "guise"?? If it's there, it needs to be dealt with....period! What are you worried about?? My kids surf the internet and we have the computer where we can monitor them, but every now and then, an advertisement will get by or something objectionable will get displayed, and it just pisses me off!!

Using the words "constitutional rights" and the phrase "children and pornography" in the same paragraph is a guise as well. What does either have to do with each other??

------------------
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Past Mustangs: '84 GT 5-speed; '91 GT auto; '70 M-code Mach 1, grabber yellow; '95 GT-S 5 speed, green, wrecked and totalled; 1995 GT-S 5 speed, bright yellow; '94 6-banger, wifes; '89 LX 5.0 vert, '90 LX 5.0 hatch, '69 M-code Mach 1, 4 speed, 1990 5.0 LX 'vert w/ AOD converted to T-5.

[This message has been edited by SUBMARINER MUSTANGER (edited 01-20-2006).]

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SUBMARINER MUSTANGER
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posted 01-20-2006 01:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SUBMARINER MUSTANGER   Click Here to Email SUBMARINER MUSTANGER     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by adragon8u:
ever see this? It's funny.
http://politicalhumor.about.com/od/funnyvideos/v/bushdrunk.htm


I don't see any humor in it. I didn't even crack a smile. It's a video of President Bush in some press conference voiced over by a guy who does impersonations. Sorry, it's stupid.

------------------
Sub Stanger/Oxford White 2003 Mach 1.
MustangsandMore Member #91
MCA Member #61863


Past Mustangs: '84 GT 5-speed; '91 GT auto; '70 M-code Mach 1, grabber yellow; '95 GT-S 5 speed, green, wrecked and totalled; 1995 GT-S 5 speed, bright yellow; '94 6-banger, wifes; '89 LX 5.0 vert, '90 LX 5.0 hatch, '69 M-code Mach 1, 4 speed, 1990 5.0 LX 'vert w/ AOD converted to T-5.

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hwyman3
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posted 01-20-2006 02:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hwyman3   Click Here to Email hwyman3     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mellowyellow:
Respect for:
Tom Delay. Bill Frist, Scooter Libby, Karl Rove, Dick Cheney and his Halliburton Billions and secret energy committee, and george bush himself. I don't think so!
[This message has been edited by mellowyellow (edited 01-20-2006).]

While we're making a list, wouldn't it be fair to include Bill Clinton, Hillary Clinton, Ted Kennedy, et. al.

Let's not pretend that spying on American Citizens is something new. What about having FBI files in the White House residence on all of your political enemies? Or sicking the IRS on your political enemies?

Which is worse, monitoring a cell phone used to call Al Queda or using federal resources to go after those in the opposing party?

According to the New York Times, the National Security Administration has been monitoring every email sent. Guess which President approved that one? That program started under President Clinton. Is reading your emails any worse than listening to selected cell phones?

I just want to point out that there is blenty of blame to go around here, not just on the Bush Administration. Previous administrations on both sides of the ploitical isles have been guilty of the same things here.

------------------
Greg W.
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cracing
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posted 01-20-2006 02:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cracing   Click Here to Email cracing     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
No respect from me for;

1 JFK, or any Kennedy
2 Slick Willy & Ms Slick Willy and (gang)
3 LB Johnson
4 Warren, of thr Warren commission
5 J. Edgar Hoover
6 George Bush, Sr & Jr.
7 John Stennis, Miss Sen for approx 50 yrs
8 John Eastland, same as Stennis
9 Ross Barnett, Ms Gov during the 60s

Just a few of a long list

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BAD COMPANY TILL THE DAY I DIE!!!!!

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mustangs68
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From: Buckroe Beach Va MCA#39406 M&M #12 Member Mustang Club of Tidewater
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posted 01-20-2006 03:55 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mustangs68   Click Here to Email mustangs68     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What wasn't said was the other Major Search Engines see no problem with providing these webpages to the DOJ..

Its really much to do about nothing


And does anyone really think we have enough people in the Federal Gov't to monitor all the millions of phone calls made each day?

The monitoring system ("wire-tapping" is really a poor choice of words)is set up to monitor for specific words ,groups of words and phrases then "red flag" this for review.

How many of you really think the "Fed's" are listing to your everyday phone calls?
They're not,move on,get over it,they are monitoring the overseas calls made daily.

I talk to Shanghai at least twice a week,email often,,I'm sure someone looked or listen,and I really feel sorry for them cause it ain't nothing exciting about Phenolic Resins
sam

[This message has been edited by mustangs68 (edited 01-20-2006).]

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clevelandstyle
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posted 01-20-2006 05:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for clevelandstyle     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm with you Sam. My theory is if you ain't doing nothin wrong, then you don't need you worry about who might hear ya. Bad guys need to worry.

------------------
Ben
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adragon8u
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From: Oceano, Ca. member# 2895
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posted 01-20-2006 08:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for adragon8u   Click Here to Email adragon8u     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by SUBMARINER MUSTANGER:
[QUOTE]Originally posted by adragon8u:
[b]ever see this? It's funny.
http://politicalhumor.about.com/od/funnyvideos/v/bushdrunk.htm


I don't see any humor in it. I didn't even crack a smile. It's a video of President Bush in some press conference voiced over by a guy who does impersonations. Sorry, it's stupid.

[/B][/QUOTE]

------------------
"It's better to have loved a short girl,
Then never to have loved a tall"
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Dad Vishus
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posted 01-20-2006 10:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dad Vishus   Click Here to Email Dad Vishus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Having respect for the country has nothing to do with this.

Bush is shoveling another bucket of political horse s**t to take attention away from way more important issues, like our young people dying every day in a war that was begun for very questionable reasons. I don't intend to get into a dabate over that particular issue, its just more important to get it resolved and stop the bloodshed.

The Google database will have literally billions of searches. How will anyone ever be able to scan all that data to garner anything of use?

The dream of contolling content on the Internet is just that, a dream. How does the US go about regulating all the content, whatever it is, from foreign countries?

This bruhaha over Google is no more than a thinly veiled attempt to placate the bible thumpers, no offense intended to anyone.

The only way to regulate what your kids see on the Internet is to monitor what they are doing all the time or keep them off it. Don't put the computer in their bedrooms or anyplace out of the way in the home. The dining room or living room keeps it where it can be easily watched. Its not just porn that needs to be prevented. There are chat rooms that have led to kidnappings and assaults, also radical groups recruit via the web. There is all kinds of really bad stuff out there, along with lots of very good content. Vigilance is the key. Anyone that truly understands the technology of the Internet knows legislative content control is impossible.

What would come to mind if someone mentioned a country where there was one set of candidates on the ballot. USSR? Nazi Germany? Communist China perhaps?

That is exactly the admitted goal of Carl Rove, the Presidents number one right hand man. A one party system of Republicans, of course, is what he and others are after. Our political system needs some repair work, but eliminating one party isn't the answer.

I see many parallels between George W. Bush and Richard M. Nixon. I thought we'd never see another President as bad as Nixon, but hes met his match. Both have shown a blatant disregard for the law and the rights of the people that elected them. I thought we'd never see another one as bad as LBJ too. Boy was I wrong about that!

To call all this radical is an understatement. Bush and his boys are good at running interference to draw attention away from far more important issues and hide their true intentions, at least they think they are good at it. If this wasn't all so deadly serious it would make a good comedy.

I have all the respect in the world for our country and the office of the President. I have no respect for a man that uses that office to further his personal interests and those of his already obscenely rich and powerful allies.

------------------
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2002 Ranger FX4 daily driver
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sigtauenus
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posted 01-22-2006 08:19 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for sigtauenus   Click Here to Email sigtauenus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My understanding isn't that the US government wanted to access all the billions of searches, but a random 1 week period to see what was searched and what came up.

All they want to do is see if a kid searches for "bunny rabbit" do they get a return that links them to the playboy website, etc. And if it does, what needs to be done to regulate how porn websites are managed or how the search engines run.

For those who don't know, if Steve wanted, he could put Chevy, Camaro, Corvette, etc in the keyword header of Mustangsandmore, and people searching for those would get this page, even though there is nothing about those subjects on this site. Porn sites do the same thing to get people "in the front door," so to speak.

Why is it so hard to understand that the government has different people with different responsibilities? So, when you say that the justice department looking into a child's access to porn is diverting attention away from the war on terror, you are implying that every government employee's only job right now is the war on terror? No, it doesn't work that way. There is such a thing as telling one person to do this and another to do that, and if they are doing both at the same time, it doesn't mean one is any less important than the other.

Don't worry, I'll take care of making sure my kid only searches for stuff like "mickey mouse" and "barney", but I'd still like to know that when he does, all he gets from the search is kid related websites to click on.

People in the military often get well deserved accolades for their service to the country. But woe to you that dedicates your life to less "noble" government jobs in the justice department, DEA, IRS, FDA, etc, because no matter how good your intentions are, its apparent that as long as President Bush is your boss anything you do is never going to be good enough.

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mustangs68
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From: Buckroe Beach Va MCA#39406 M&M #12 Member Mustang Club of Tidewater
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posted 01-22-2006 10:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mustangs68   Click Here to Email mustangs68     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
META tags,which are set up for search engine robots,can contain any information the writer desires.

Sams correct,I can do that my 68 site,change the META tags and Monday when the Bots sweep my site,which I have setup to be done every other week,they will pick up the new words.

I can add "classic chevy" or "large breasted women" to the list and the Bots don't know the difference.

I think it's a common sense thing that these assh_les are stopped from doing this.

As for how well Bush has done,only History will tell.And if I'm not mistaken it the job of each party to stay in power and control Congress.The Democrats sure are trying had to get back in control.So to say one Party want to control is correct,thats what they want to do be it GOP or the Democrats.


Sam

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mellowyellow
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posted 01-22-2006 10:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mellowyellow     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dad Vishus:
Having respect for the country has nothing to do with this. (Yes it does, Dad! Expressing concern for the welfare of YOUR Country is just that!!)

This bruhaha over Google is no more than a thinly veiled attempt to placate the bible thumpers, no offense intended to anyone.

(One thing about bush, he pays back his supporters. "Placate" is putting it mildly when it comes to Corporate America!)

Its not just porn that needs to be prevented. There are chat rooms that have led to kidnappings and assaults, also radical groups recruit via the web. There is all kinds of really bad stuff out there, along with lots of very good content. Vigilance is the key. Anyone that truly understands the technology of the Internet knows legislative content control is impossible.

What would come to mind if someone mentioned a country where there was one set of candidates on the ballot. USSR? Nazi Germany? Communist China perhaps?

(And one thing these countries did was censor and regulate communications. Trying to get into the Internet by a country, with an eye toward "protecting the populace" is frightening!}Investigating porn is just a stepping stone.

That is exactly the admitted goal of Carl Rove, the Presidents number one right hand man. A one party system of Republicans, of course, is what he and others are after. Our political system needs some repair work, but eliminating one party isn't the answer.

I see many parallels between George W. Bush and Richard M. Nixon. I thought we'd never see another President as bad as Nixon, but hes met his match. Both have shown a blatant disregard for the law and the rights of the people that elected them. I thought we'd never see another one as bad as LBJ too. Boy was I wrong about that!

To call all this radical is an understatement. Bush and his boys are good at running interference to draw attention away from far more important issues and hide their true intentions, at least they think they are good at it. If this wasn't all so deadly serious it would make a good comedy.

I have all the respect in the world for our country and the office of the President. I have no respect for a man that uses that office to further his personal interests and those of his already obscenely rich and powerful allies.



Well Put. Karl Rogue makes no secret of his intentions. Neither does China. Why no dialog from the "administration", on this serious problem, other than the amateurish embarrassing visit to that country by bush. Why no mention of their presence in the Panamal Canal or their port in the Bahamas, or their major involvement with ALL the major countries in S. America, or Cuba, or the Middle East. Given this, what makes anyone think that, at some point, China would not seize the Amercian built companies in that country, at an "appropriate time" and take over the reigns. Does anyone know the amount of our trade deficit for 2005? And how much of that money recieved by China is being invested in American Securites? Maybe a refresher by the infamas Nikita Kruchev (sp) who made the paraphrased statement....we'll conquer you from within. Corporate America, so tunnel vision consumed with profits, that they blindly help build up the machinery to give China a MORE than obcenely rich Gross National Product, while our trade deficit is bolstered by a person who gives these American companies tax credits. Companies, who then ride the wave of large profits, yet fail to lower the price of their goods!

Read an interesting, timely article called Made In America, by Eric Peters. It's on AOL this AM. Am sure that it would be on Google. Oh Dear!! I mentioned the "G" word!!

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adragon8u
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From: Oceano, Ca. member# 2895
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posted 01-22-2006 11:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for adragon8u   Click Here to Email adragon8u     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here's another video of Bush that I'm sure will cause some to think about why Bush has lost the respect of several Americans.
http://politicalhumor.about.com/od/bushvideos/v/bushfinger.htm
that, and Cheney giving the "go **** youself" reply tells me that they couldn't care less. I can respect the office, just not the man/men who hold it.

------------------
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Then never to have loved a tall"
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mustangs68
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posted 01-22-2006 11:44 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mustangs68   Click Here to Email mustangs68     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
bolstered by a person who gives these American companies tax credits

Could you PLEASE list these Tax Credits so I can let my VP of Finance know.

Panama Canal or their port in the Bahamas, or their major involvement with ALL the major countries in S. America, or Cuba, or the Middle East

We need to protect our interest in Panama, we MUST!!

Bahamas,heck we have had a "secret military base" there since the mid 50's

Cuba- pretty important I'd say with a hostile Nation 90 miles off our Southern Coast.

As for South America we need to get involved with the developing Nations before Red China stakes claim to them.

I just like to know when we're getting out of Europe,we have been there since the end of WWII,how come no-one complains about this waste of a tax dollar????
Sam

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Catmando
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posted 01-23-2006 02:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Catmando   Click Here to Email Catmando     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
September 11th. I remember watching the tv, at a loss for words. I remember how angry I became as I saw American citizens, covered in soot, walking aimlessly in the streets of New York. I remember people posting pictures of missing loved ones on fences and poles. I remember getting my kids out of school early because I didn't know what to do or what was happening next. I remember going to work that night, nobody really said anything much to each other, I guess we were all at a loss for words. I remember the quiet skys in the days following. I was angry, scared, confused, and unsure of the future.
I then remember the Presidents speach made on TV. I remember the President standing in the rubble with the Firemen and the speach he made then. Then I was proud, and sure, and confident we would overcome.
That is all I need to remember to know that President Bush was THE leader we needed at that time in America.
Sleep in peace tonight, people are out there trying to protect us. Even if we try to hamper them with unrealistic concerns.

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adragon8u
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posted 01-23-2006 09:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for adragon8u   Click Here to Email adragon8u     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
One GOOD deed doesn't excuse a person from the mistakes that follow.

------------------
"It's better to have loved a short girl,
Then never to have loved a tall"
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Toronado3800
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posted 01-23-2006 12:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Toronado3800     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ever watch that histroy channel special on the Russian/Afgan war? I caught it last week with a couple buddies of mine. The CIA training the Muja hadine (spelling error!) and select Islamic radicals how to fire stinger missles, and attack military strong points got alot of "no way"s out of the crowd. Also made them think different about the glorified Reagon foreign policy.

So, 20 years later the foreign policy communicator seems like a buffoon. We'll see about this boy in 20 years but geez, now we know what Bush I was avoiding with his mysterious 100 hour war pull out (retreat?)fifteen years ago.... strange how the people blowing themselves up in our faces now were in their formative years fifteen years ago.

Don't know what the right answer is though or I'd tell you all.

[This message has been edited by Toronado3800 (edited 01-23-2006).]

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cracing
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posted 01-23-2006 05:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for cracing   Click Here to Email cracing     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I cant see why the politicians cant see that when gas prices go down, their popularity goes up in the polls that they are SO concerned about, and when prices go up the opposite is true. People are more concerned with their own lives and finances than they are Iraq or Iran etc.

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beachbum
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posted 01-24-2006 10:59 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for beachbum     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Catmando:
September 11th. I remember watching the tv, at a loss for words. I remember how angry I became as I saw American citizens, covered in soot, walking aimlessly in the streets of New York. I remember people posting pictures of missing loved ones on fences and poles. I remember getting my kids out of school early because I didn't know what to do or what was happening next. I remember going to work that night, nobody really said anything much to each other, I guess we were all at a loss for words. I remember the quiet skys in the days following. I was angry, scared, confused, and unsure of the future.
I then remember the Presidents speach made on TV. I remember the President standing in the rubble with the Firemen and the speach he made then. Then I was proud, and sure, and confident we would overcome.
That is all I need to remember to know that President Bush was THE leader we needed at that time in America.
Sleep in peace tonight, people are out there trying to protect us. Even if we try to hamper them with unrealistic concerns.

Very well put and I agree with you, I sleep so much better and am so proud of the President and the leadership he brings to our country. I feel so much safer with him leading us and not backing down to terrorists in any way. I shutter to think if he did try and set down and talk with these people. We are at war and he is doing all the right things to keep us safe and yeah if he wants to listen in on a conversation between possible terrorists, that's fine with me.

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Catmando
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posted 01-24-2006 08:49 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Catmando   Click Here to Email Catmando     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Besides, if Google can put all of our cell phone records on the internet ( for a small fee of course), I don't see why "Bush and his gang" cannot take interest in some dirtbag speaking with some terroist overseas.
All Im saying is this argument is political party jibberish. Its junk and has been done before, is being done, and will be done. I support Bush and "his gang" in thier efforts to protect us.
If you pick a different subject matter to bash Bush and his gang, I may join in with you because there are several things I don't like that he is doing. But most Bush bashing is political banter, most worthless.

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Dad Vishus
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posted 01-24-2006 10:22 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dad Vishus   Click Here to Email Dad Vishus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Why would a terrorist be using Google to speak to anyone? If the real reason is to intercept messages, email systems are what should be watched.

If anyone can access searches to look for lawbreakers, look out!

Some gang of uniforms might come kicking in your door cause somebody did a Google search for Barbie Dolls.

Headers can be used to divert searches anywhere quite easily. A perfectly innocent search could lead to something entirely different.

Just be careful what you wish for and support.

BTW, I'm a fiercely independent voter. I will never register for a party.

------------------
63 Falcon 377 Cleveland stroker Flying Toilet alchohol injection. 6.19 @ 110 MPH 1/8 mile
2002 Ranger FX4 daily driver
2000 F350 PSD Crew cab dually - Like commuting in a B52!!
98 US Cargo Phantom II 28'

[This message has been edited by Dad Vishus (edited 01-24-2006).]

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Catmando
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Posts: 225
From: Vermilion, OH USA
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 01-25-2006 12:41 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Catmando   Click Here to Email Catmando     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
DV, I too am not affiliated with a party. Though I support Bush and what he is doing,(militarily) and based on what I have said you may think Im stictly "right wing", but I am not.
I guess I am just bored to tears with all of the Bush bashing. This is worse than when Clinton was in office. There were alot of things I did not like about him, but many that I did. But I got sick and tired of everything on earth being blamed on him and his "gang". It is now happening again, in greater frequency, with Bush.
As for Bush, I support his policy against terroism, both against Afghanistan and Iraq. I support his steps taken at homeland security. I do not like how he is handling "big oil", I think we are being screwed. I cannot understand his open arms treatment of illegal immigrants.
But, in my opinion, our national security comes first. It doesn't matter how cheap our fuel is, or how much money we are making, if we had to worry about suicide bombers blowing themselves up at every shopping mall or coffee house in America our economy and society would be destroyed.
And trust me on this. If someone knocks on my door to collect my weapons (or Barbie dolls) there will be a fight.
This is bumming me out, time to go read stuff about race cars or something fun!!!

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SkinnyMan
Gearhead

Posts: 451
From: Tupelo, MS - USA
Registered: Jan 2005

posted 01-25-2006 01:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for SkinnyMan   Click Here to Email SkinnyMan     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mellowyellow:
Furthur chiseling away at Constitutional Rights: The bush gang is now targeting Google, under the guise of protecting children from pornography. They want access to Google's database.

Meanwhile Google is doing everything the Chineses want them to, including censoring searches. -
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,182695,00.html

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SkinnyMan
Tupelo, MS

Thank you, Thank you very much!

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lcl
Journeyman

Posts: 93
From: new waterford oh
Registered: Mar 2005

posted 01-25-2006 04:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for lcl   Click Here to Email lcl     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I don't remember seeing google mentioned in the constitution?
We live in the greatest country in the world, we (the people) have the power to remove, or replace OUR "leaders". Yeah it's not perfect (nor will it ever be) but I believe that it is the best system devised by humans to govern and placate the populace. Technology is moving and evolving at such a fast pace that it is getting ahead of our ability to monitor (and I use these words loosely) and control. We Americans have something that a lot of people who inhabit this planet do not, we have the freedom of choice, We can decide what we want our children and ourselves to view, read or create. It's a debate that will never end (but evolve beyond us and our current beliefs and situations). That's what makes (I believe) this country so great. I'd love to be around in 50 years to see or hear what our children/grandchildren are discussing or debating, as long they still have the right to do so.

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capri man
Gearhead

Posts: 7639
From: doerun, ga.
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-25-2006 07:47 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for capri man   Click Here to Email capri man     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dad Vishus:

BTW, I'm a fiercely independent voter. I will never register for a party.


A BIG AMEN DV!!! anyone who votes for a candidate because he/she is with a certain party is an IDIOT!!!

------------------
mike r
racing is real
everything else is just a game.
81 capri-302-7.25 @93mph 1/8
1.54 60ft 50 % of the fun dragracing is meeting people who will give you the shirt off their back to wipe the grease off your hands.
M&M member #839 http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y6/mike470/adel2.jpg

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sigtauenus
Gearhead

Posts: 3291
From: Va Beach
Registered: Jun 2000

posted 01-25-2006 09:35 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for sigtauenus   Click Here to Email sigtauenus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by capri man:
A BIG AMEN DV!!! anyone who votes for a candidate because he/she is with a certain party is an IDIOT!!!

I agree. It kills me that you can walk into the ballot box and pull a lever for "all republican" or "all democrat", etc.

I tend to lead towards the right, but like others here have disagreements with some things the republicans do. Right now I can't stand the corruption with lobbying and campaign funding from either side of the aisle, I can't stand the situation on the Mexican border, I also have issues with abortion, marriage in general let alone gay marriage, the tax structure, health care, social security, etc. Point being, there are some Democrats I'd have no problem supporting, Joe Liberman is a perfect example of a very principled man who often gets pushed aside due to not mindlessly touting the party line at every turn.

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Dad Vishus
Gearhead

Posts: 1067
From: Moscow, Iowa, USA
Registered: Dec 2001

posted 01-25-2006 11:08 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dad Vishus   Click Here to Email Dad Vishus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Take a gander at this.

http://www.computerworld.com/securitytopics/security/privacy/story/0,10801,107993,00.html

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63 Falcon 377 Cleveland stroker Flying Toilet alchohol injection. 6.19 @ 110 MPH 1/8 mile
2002 Ranger FX4 daily driver
2000 F350 PSD Crew cab dually - Like commuting in a B52!!
98 US Cargo Phantom II 28'

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mustangs68
Moderator

Posts: 25294
From: Buckroe Beach Va MCA#39406 M&M #12 Member Mustang Club of Tidewater
Registered: May 99

posted 01-25-2006 04:45 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mustangs68   Click Here to Email mustangs68     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A majority of 1,017 Americans....
Now there's a diclaimer if I ever saw one
Sam

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SteveLaRiviere
Administrator

Posts: 45913
From: Saco, Maine
Registered: May 99

posted 01-25-2006 04:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SteveLaRiviere   Click Here to Email SteveLaRiviere     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by capri man:
A BIG AMEN DV!!! anyone who votes for a candidate because he/she is with a certain party is an IDIOT!!!


I agree! Morons come from both sides of the aisle.

Never forget that in any election, all you are voting for is a puppet, it almost doesn't matter who gets elected, really. The country will always be truly run by unseen forces, the way it is currently set up.

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'70 Mustang Mach 1 - '70 Mustang Convertible - '72 Mustang Sprint - '94 F-150 XL

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71RESTO
Gearhead

Posts: 1440
From: Oregon, USA
Registered: Oct 2000

posted 01-25-2006 06:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 71RESTO   Click Here to Email 71RESTO     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by lcl:

We live in the greatest country in the world, we (the people) have the power to remove, or replace OUR "leaders". Yeah it's not perfect (nor will it ever be) but I believe that it is the best system devised by humans to govern and placate the populace.

Not to start a flame war, but I get fired up about these type of very general statements. And yes, I am an American!!
Yes, you can be proud of your country and all that it stands for. BUT, unless you have lived in every other single country on the planet and lived under every other form of government there is ABSOLUTELY no way you can possibly make this type of general statement and it acutally being an informed one.
Are you going to tell me that the Aussies, or Canadians, or Brits, or French, or Scandavians, etc, etc. don't have the same position in regards to their countries or forms of government? And YES, they also have the ability to remove or replace their leaders without a civil war erupting. So, who's is really the best????
Bottom line, to say you live in the greatest country with the best form of government is basically just your own opinion and not something determined through research.

I'll jump off my soap box now and yield the floor to the next speaker.

------------------
Duane
71 Fastback (under resto-351C-4V C6 auto)
M & M Member #730

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SteveLaRiviere
Administrator

Posts: 45913
From: Saco, Maine
Registered: May 99

posted 01-25-2006 06:26 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for SteveLaRiviere   Click Here to Email SteveLaRiviere     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
How about the statement "I wouldn't want to live anywhere else."

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'70 Mustang Mach 1 - '70 Mustang Convertible - '72 Mustang Sprint - '94 F-150 XL

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Dad Vishus
Gearhead

Posts: 1067
From: Moscow, Iowa, USA
Registered: Dec 2001

posted 01-25-2006 09:47 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dad Vishus   Click Here to Email Dad Vishus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
With the Feds poking into Internet activity, and I believe they will, leaglly or not, and local governments putting stop light cameras and speeding cameras everywhere right down to your local C-store with their security cameras, Orwell was right. Big Brother IS Watching. His timing was just a little off.

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63 Falcon 377 Cleveland stroker Flying Toilet alchohol injection. 6.19 @ 110 MPH 1/8 mile
2002 Ranger FX4 daily driver
2000 F350 PSD Crew cab dually - Like commuting in a B52!!
98 US Cargo Phantom II 28'

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hwyman3
Gearhead

Posts: 1660
From: Southern Maryland, USA
Registered: Jul 2004

posted 01-25-2006 09:50 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hwyman3   Click Here to Email hwyman3     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dad Vishus:
With the Feds poking into Internet activity, and I believe they will


Almost makes me wish Al Gore never invented the interent!

------------------
Greg W.
M&M #3962 MCA #52100
2002 Laser Red GT Coupe The Highwayman 3
1991 F-150 XLT 4x2 5.0 Ole Faithful
Southern Maryland Mustang Club
http://mustangsandmore.50megs.com/MembersPics/hwyman3.html

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Catmando
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Posts: 225
From: Vermilion, OH USA
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 01-25-2006 10:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Catmando   Click Here to Email Catmando     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
All right Hwyman3 for some comic relief!!! Dad Vishus, I know for a fact the cameras are not so we can be monitered, it is for cash flow! All of those cameras and about 75% of traffic enforcement is nothing but revenue collection!! It makes me puke. Traffic enforcement for revenue is way, way, way out of hand.

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Dad Vishus
Gearhead

Posts: 1067
From: Moscow, Iowa, USA
Registered: Dec 2001

posted 01-25-2006 10:41 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dad Vishus   Click Here to Email Dad Vishus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by hwyman3:

Almost makes me wish Al Gore never invented the interent!




LOL

Yeah, I might just get a webcam so they can be bored to death watching all my suspect activities.

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63 Falcon 377 Cleveland stroker Flying Toilet alchohol injection. 6.19 @ 110 MPH 1/8 mile
2002 Ranger FX4 daily driver
2000 F350 PSD Crew cab dually - Like commuting in a B52!!
98 US Cargo Phantom II 28'

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MLariviere
Moderator

Posts: 4120
From: Biddeford,Me.USA
Registered: May 99

posted 01-25-2006 11:06 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for MLariviere   Click Here to Email MLariviere     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
China would not seize the Amercian built companies in that country, at an "appropriate time" and take over the reigns. Does anyone know the amount of our trade deficit for 2005? And how much of that money recieved by China is being invested in American Securites? Maybe a refresher by the infamas Nikita Kruchev (sp) who made the paraphrased statement....we'll conquer you from within. Corporate America, so tunnel vision consumed with profits, that they blindly help build up the machinery to give China a MORE than obcenely rich Gross National Product, while our trade deficit is bolstered by a person who gives these American companies tax credits. Companies, who then ride the wave of large profits, yet fail to lower the price of their goods!

We are all to blame for this deficit,not just the administration. Every time we purchase,we vote with our wallets. Remember that the next time you buy a "quality foreign car". We as a country need to go back to our roots and become more self dependent for products. There should be stiff tarriffs on things we import,and even to the point of banning importation of goods we produce altogether.

Another point to look at: Most of these third world nations are driven by drug money,even bigger than oil. IMHO the illegal drug industry needs to be erradicated. We are at a crucial time in this war,and the smuggling of this stuff has to stop. I really believe that if this problem went away,other problems would soon have solutions too.

[This message has been edited by MLariviere (edited 01-25-2006).]

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hwyman3
Gearhead

Posts: 1660
From: Southern Maryland, USA
Registered: Jul 2004

posted 01-25-2006 11:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hwyman3   Click Here to Email hwyman3     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Catmando:
All right Hwyman3 for some comic relief!!! Dad Vishus, I know for a fact the cameras are not so we can be monitered, it is for cash flow! All of those cameras and about 75% of traffic enforcement is nothing but revenue collection!! It makes me puke. Traffic enforcement for revenue is way, way, way out of hand.

In all seriousness, I wholeheartedly agree about the "traffic enforcement" cameras being for revenue generation and not about traffic safety. Several news organizations have done studies where yellow light timing has been shortened AFTER cameras were installed. Heck, even when Washington, DC wanted Speed Cameras, their justification was revenue, not safety.

------------------
Greg W.
M&M #3962 MCA #52100
2002 Laser Red GT Coupe The Highwayman 3
1991 F-150 XLT 4x2 5.0 Ole Faithful
Southern Maryland Mustang Club
http://mustangsandmore.50megs.com/MembersPics/hwyman3.html

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Big D
Gearhead

Posts: 6076
From: WELLS, NEVADA USA
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 01-26-2006 03:16 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Big D   Click Here to Email Big D     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Man,, Is this thread base on what America is about or what..

------------------
Don
6T6 Fastback
331 STROKER, T-5

Metallic Royal Blue & Silver
Candy Orange-Red Flames by McGrafix
My Pics

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mellowyellow
Gearhead

Posts: 7377
From: So. Fl.
Registered: Aug 2000

posted 01-26-2006 09:51 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for mellowyellow     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by adragon8u:
One GOOD deed doesn't excuse a person from the mistakes that follow.


He's like a surfer chasing the 9th wave, catching it, thinking he can ride it forever!!
Reminds me of a boss I had and to paraphrase: "Never mind what good move you did yesterday, what are going to do today!!"

He acted as a President would in the face of disaster, and not to downplay it nor to put it in the forefront of an entire term{s}. So yesterday, he made an emphatic issue of terrorism, suggesting that those who aren't with him are probably supporters. An exaggeration, yes, but his squinty eyed, line in the sand, knock the chip off my shoulder demeanor said it well! Well.......yesterday, watching the video of the Mexican army helping a truck, mired in the Rio Grande, loaded with bales of pot, come into the US, IN PLAIN VIEW, WITH ABSOLUTELY NO INTERFERENCE is hard to take! This, while the so-called head of the Department Of Homeland Security pooh-poohs the whole Mexican "affair". The "our gang" up 'til yesterday, distanced themselves from the whole border fracas. They have steadfastly been against the fence, enforcement, and have ignored the protests of ALL 48 states, many of whom are enacting laws. This is all about payback to supporters. If it isn't please enlighten!! With those here, and those future "invited workers" that bush favors,we are talking in the millions. Not protesting as the so-called president,honcho, whatever, of Mexico spurs it on, saying they have the right to come into our Country, any time!!!!!!!!!! while "our gang" played Ostrich with head in the sand!
How EASY for an Alcrapo Terrorist to dress "appropriatly" and casually walk across with a map furnished by support groups. And while this was happening,our "fearless leader" was visiting the Intelligence Headquarters in Maryland, touting our fight against terror!!!!

Does that give anyone a "warm fuzzy feeling"? DEA had been scaled back. Customs, here, was scaled back, Airline Security takes a kick, as scissors and knivees are allowed-as long as they're under a certain limit. Any Con would tell you that a 4" shank could do a lot-particularly while in the air!

Comments yesterday, about the Army being overtaxed and Donald Rumdum's answer typifies the whole deal! A shrug of the shoulders, blaming the previous "gang"

Am an older person who didn't care for LBJ, some of Nixon's stuff(and I voted for him- once}, Carter, and some of Reagan's stuff, Clinton, and some of his stuff, but nothing, absolutely nothing, tops this clown! Get a kick outta him on his raunch, he's now got a new pickumup truck, and choppin' wood!

Like any American who is unhapppy about leaders in many other countries, Iran, Palestine, Venezuela, Bolivia, and on and on, feel we are getting bad cards in the game as long as the bush administration deals them-or doesn't!

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Buster
Gearhead

Posts: 1636
From: Hurricane alley
Registered: May 2002

posted 01-26-2006 10:30 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Buster   Click Here to Email Buster     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by mustangs68:
[B
Bahamas,heck we have had a "secret military base" there since the mid 50's

[/B]


I guess it's not that secret now, lol.

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beachbum
Gearhead

Posts: 260
From: Florida
Registered: Oct 2001

posted 01-26-2006 11:25 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for beachbum     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Catmando:
Traffic enforcement for revenue is way, way, way out of hand. [/B]

Maybe I don't understand that statement or it may be a joke, but in my area if they wanted to enforce the traffic laws on the interstates or any roadways they could write traffic tickets for speeding or running red lights every minute, all day long, seven days a week and make millions, but they don't.

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mustangs68
Moderator

Posts: 25294
From: Buckroe Beach Va MCA#39406 M&M #12 Member Mustang Club of Tidewater
Registered: May 99

posted 01-26-2006 04:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mustangs68   Click Here to Email mustangs68     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
LOL..Buster
MRA (Military Rich Area)

But it's good to see Air America Radio is alive and well

Sam

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Dad Vishus
Gearhead

Posts: 1067
From: Moscow, Iowa, USA
Registered: Dec 2001

posted 01-26-2006 10:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dad Vishus   Click Here to Email Dad Vishus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by beachbum:
Maybe I don't understand that statement or it may be a joke, but in my area if they wanted to enforce the traffic laws on the interstates or any roadways they could write traffic tickets for speeding or running red lights every minute, all day long, seven days a week and make millions, but they don't.

I suppose it must be an efficiency thing.

Instead of actually stopping the violaters, they just sit in the office and wait for the pictures, sending out "invitations" to come pay your fine instead of writing tickets on the street.

I thought that was called entrapment at one time.

There is alot of controversy around here about this.

I have some questions about these cameras.

Can they get an identifiable photo of the driver?

If not, do they issue the ticket to the car?

If its the owner that gets the ticket, what about when a vehicle is registered to more than one person, like a husband and wife, or a company?

I'm not opposed to enforcement of traffic laws but this a darned cheesy method.

------------------
63 Falcon 377 Cleveland stroker Flying Toilet alchohol injection. 6.19 @ 110 MPH 1/8 mile
2002 Ranger FX4 daily driver
2000 F350 PSD Crew cab dually - Like commuting in a B52!!
98 US Cargo Phantom II 28'

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hwyman3
Gearhead

Posts: 1660
From: Southern Maryland, USA
Registered: Jul 2004

posted 01-26-2006 10:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hwyman3   Click Here to Email hwyman3     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Dad Vishus:
I suppose it must be an efficiency thing.

Instead of actually stopping the violaters, they just sit in the office and wait for the pictures, sending out "invitations" to come pay your fine instead of writing tickets on the street.

I thought that was called entrapment at one time.

There is alot of controversy around here about this.

I have some questions about these cameras.

Can they get an identifiable photo of the driver?

If not, do they issue the ticket to the car?

If its the owner that gets the ticket, what about when a vehicle is registered to more than one person, like a husband and wife, or a company?

I'm not opposed to enforcement of traffic laws but this a darned cheesy method.



You have it right, at least with Maryland's cameras. In Maryland, the owner of the vehicle is responsible, not the driver. The owner pays a $75 fine for every infraction. The state doesn't care who's name is on the title, be it joint ownership or a corporation. SOmething like this actually bit Ford big time in Detroit. Detroit sued Ford over parking tickets on cars Ford leased to people and the tickets were unpaid. The courts forced Ford to pay the fines anyway, since legally Ford owned the cars and was responsible.

Let me use this example to cite why I hate these cameras so much. Let's say I loan my truck to a friend of mine. He goes out and runs a red light. I get teh ticket. Now, I have to go to court and prove I did not break the law. It is assumed that I am guilty until proven innocent. I always thought the opposite was supposed to be true, that you were innocent until proven guilty. The picture proves my truck ran the red light. It doesn't prove that I ran the red light.

------------------
Greg W.
M&M #3962 MCA #52100
2002 Laser Red GT Coupe The Highwayman 3
1991 F-150 XLT 4x2 5.0 Ole Faithful
Southern Maryland Mustang Club
http://mustangsandmore.50megs.com/MembersPics/hwyman3.html

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Catmando
Gearhead

Posts: 225
From: Vermilion, OH USA
Registered: Jun 2004

posted 01-27-2006 12:06 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Catmando   Click Here to Email Catmando     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I didn't start this thread, but I think it has been blown off course a bit.
If Mohammad Igottabomb has a pattern of contacting certain people in the U.S.A, why on Earth should we not look into this??? I think our goverment would be neglegent if they did not. Part of the Bush bashing does include "his" government branches not sharing information on what we knew about the terroists that hit us on 9-11. I don't think we can have it both ways. We cannot be critical of Bush or whomever is the Commander in Chief for doing too much and then in the same breath say he didn't do enough.

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hwyman3
Gearhead

Posts: 1660
From: Southern Maryland, USA
Registered: Jul 2004

posted 01-27-2006 12:12 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for hwyman3   Click Here to Email hwyman3     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Catmando:
I didn't start this thread, but I think it has been blown off course a bit.
If Mohammad Igottabomb has a pattern of contacting certain people in the U.S.A, why on Earth should we not look into this??? I think our goverment would be neglegent if they did not. Part of the Bush bashing does include "his" government branches not sharing information on what we knew about the terroists that hit us on 9-11. I don't think we can have it both ways. We cannot be critical of Bush or whomever is the Commander in Chief for doing too much and then in the same breath say he didn't do enough.

Amen. Bush is in a no win situation. Either he doesn't do enough to stop a terrorist attack, or when he does something to keep the terrorists in check he has over-stepped his authority!

------------------
Greg W.
M&M #3962 MCA #52100
2002 Laser Red GT Coupe The Highwayman 3
1991 F-150 XLT 4x2 5.0 Ole Faithful
Southern Maryland Mustang Club
http://mustangsandmore.50megs.com/MembersPics/hwyman3.html

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Fastback68
Gearhead

Posts: 3946
From: Sucat, Paranaque, Philippines
Registered: Jul 99

posted 01-27-2006 01:31 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Fastback68   Click Here to Email Fastback68     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Bottom line, to say you live in the greatest country with the best form of government is basically just your own opinion and not something determined through research.

Thank you Duane Reading your post was like reading something I've written myself many a time! I've never heard it from an American though.

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beachbum
Gearhead

Posts: 260
From: Florida
Registered: Oct 2001

posted 01-27-2006 12:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for beachbum     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Fastback68:
[QUOTE]Bottom line, to say you live in the greatest country with the best form of government is basically just your own opinion and not something determined through research.


Thank you Duane Reading your post was like reading something I've written myself many a time! I've never heard it from an American though.
[/QUOTE]


That is the great thing about living here, we can have an opinion about anything or anyone, tell all and go about our merry way without fear of retaliation from the government. That is great, so why not yell it from the rooftops.

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sigtauenus
Gearhead

Posts: 3291
From: Va Beach
Registered: Jun 2000

posted 01-27-2006 12:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for sigtauenus   Click Here to Email sigtauenus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by hwyman3:
Let me use this example to cite why I hate these cameras so much. Let's say I loan my truck to a friend of mine. He goes out and runs a red light. I get teh ticket. Now, I have to go to court and prove I did not break the law. It is assumed that I am guilty until proven innocent. I always thought the opposite was supposed to be true, that you were innocent until proven guilty. The picture proves my truck ran the red light. It doesn't prove that I ran the red light.

How about you own a 9mm that is not locked up and your kid takes it to school and caps the guy who picks on him everyday. Are you not negligent on that part for allowing your kid to commit a crime even though the kid does not actually own the gun.

Why should this be any different? If your buddy wants to borrow your truck, I'd say tell him not to run any red lights or he'll be paying the fine and the increase in your insurance.

To me this is easy. Similar to what was just said about Bush, damned if you do, damned if you don't. Cities have people complaining about too many people running redlights, people needlessly getting killed in traffic accidents, and not enough police to go around. So now technology comes along that frees up police to go chase bad guys instead of sitting on street corners, and wow complaints abound that the government is overstepping their bounds.

I see your point that their is great pain put upon an innocent person to prove they are innocent. Perhaps there should be an administrative function where you can call your buddy up and say "hey, WTF dude, you ran a redlight and I got the ticket", and the buddy can call an 800 number or go online or go to court with you and he pays the fine and he gets the points on his license if applicable, thus accepting responsibility for the crime.

Beyond that, hey, its your truck, so its your responsibility.

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71RESTO
Gearhead

Posts: 1440
From: Oregon, USA
Registered: Oct 2000

posted 01-27-2006 01:21 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 71RESTO   Click Here to Email 71RESTO     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by beachbum:

That is the great thing about living here, we can have an opinion about anything or anyone, tell all and go about our merry way without fear of retaliation from the government. That is great, so why not yell it from the rooftops.

Basically you missed the WHOLE point of my response. Yes we can have opinions, state them and not worry about retaliation. BUTTTTTT, how is that any different from Australia, Canada, Britian, France, Germany, Sweden, Norway, etc, etc. etc. or any other country with a democratically elected government??
The point being we have this freedom, but so do all the other countries I stated and it doesn't make ours "the Best" over theirs or our country any worse than any of theirs. They ALL have their good and bad points and without having lived in or done research on every single other country on the planet there is NO WAY to construe that "AMERICA is the Best" as a truly informed opinion.

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Duane
71 Fastback (under resto-351C-4V C6 auto)
M & M Member #730

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beachbum
Gearhead

Posts: 260
From: Florida
Registered: Oct 2001

posted 01-27-2006 01:48 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for beachbum     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by 71RESTO:
Basically you missed the WHOLE point of my response. Yes we can have opinions, state them and not worry about retaliation. BUTTTTTT, how is that any different from Australia, Canada, Britian, France, Germany, Sweden, Norway, etc, etc. etc. or any other country with a democratically elected government??
The point being we have this freedom, but so do all the other countries I stated and it doesn't make ours "the Best" over theirs or our country any worse than any of theirs. They ALL have their good and bad points and without having lived in or done research on every single other country on the planet there is NO WAY to construe that "AMERICA is the Best" as a truly informed opinion.



OK, I get your point but my point is I don't have any desire whatsoever to live in any of those countries, so why should I live anywhere else just to prove a point. I love it here and want to live here the rest of my life and am proud of my country and want to brag about it.

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hwyman3
Gearhead

Posts: 1660
From: Southern Maryland, USA
Registered: Jul 2004

posted 01-29-2006 09:15 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for hwyman3   Click Here to Email hwyman3     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by sigtauenus:
How about you own a 9mm that is not locked up and your kid takes it to school and caps the guy who picks on him everyday. Are you not negligent on that part for allowing your kid to commit a crime even though the kid does not actually own the gun.

Why should this be any different? If your buddy wants to borrow your truck, I'd say tell him not to run any red lights or he'll be paying the fine and the increase in your insurance.

To me this is easy. Similar to what was just said about Bush, damned if you do, damned if you don't. Cities have people complaining about too many people running redlights, people needlessly getting killed in traffic accidents, and not enough police to go around. So now technology comes along that frees up police to go chase bad guys instead of sitting on street corners, and wow complaints abound that the government is overstepping their bounds.

I see your point that their is great pain put upon an innocent person to prove they are innocent. Perhaps there should be an administrative function where you can call your buddy up and say "hey, WTF dude, you ran a redlight and I got the ticket", and the buddy can call an 800 number or go online or go to court with you and he pays the fine and he gets the points on his license if applicable, thus accepting responsibility for the crime.

Beyond that, hey, its your truck, so its your responsibility.


That's kind of an apples and oranges comparrison. If I owned a 9mm gun, it would be kept under lock and key and if I had children in the house, then they would be educated about the gun and how they are not to ever touch that safe and the keys would be kept away from them. It's called responsible gun ownership.

Now for the red light cameras, If I loan my vehicle out to someone, granted it is my responsibility to make sure I loan it to someone responsible. However, if the person I loan it to run the red light, still there is nothing to respect the part of the Consitiution that states I am innocent until proven guilty. Again, that camera proves my vehicle was going through the red light, there is no proof that I went through it. Plus, what about jurisdictions that shorten the time of a yellow light, just to get more violations. Most of these cameras are run by a contractor that gets a cut of every citation. Plus, because of these shortened yellow lights, you are finding more rear end collisions because of people stopping too quickly at the light.

I don't mind police coming up with creative ways to enforce the laws, however the cameras raise too many ethical questions. For example, if the goal is law enforcement and not revenue enhancement, then they could simply park a surplus cruiser in areas that are prone to red light running. Many police departments have tried this in areas where speeding has been a problem and it has met with incredible sucess.

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Greg W.
M&M #3962 MCA #52100
2002 Laser Red GT Coupe The Highwayman 3
1991 F-150 XLT 4x2 5.0 Ole Faithful
Southern Maryland Mustang Club
http://mustangsandmore.50megs.com/MembersPics/hwyman3.html

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