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Author
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Topic: Edelbrock vs Demon carb
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JJonesy99
Journeyman Posts: 43
From: Lakewood, CO USA
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 12:06 AM
   
I have 408w and i'm running lows 12's @ altitude (Denver). Its now equiped with a 750 edelbrock, but my friend has an extra 750 speed demon on the shelf. I was wondering if the demon would pick me up any ET? I've read many dislikes on the forum about the demon, and many likes for the Holley. Need help on the carb, holley, edelbrock, demon? Is may edelbrock hurting my ET, that bad?Thanks Jason
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 26575
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 07-07-2005 12:19 AM
Holley.------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA & SS/MA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,'03,'04 &'05
First NHRA & IHRA 289 automatic Superstock Mustang in the TENS 06-99
First SS/MA in the TENS 04-03
IHRA division 5 Superstock Champion
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28 The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
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JJonesy99
Journeyman Posts: 43
From: Lakewood, CO USA
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 12:25 AM
Alex, I'm lost with anything other than an edelbrock. What holley carb would you suggest? Its a daily driver but goes to the track every weekend.Jason
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 26575
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 07-07-2005 12:27 AM
Latest incarnation of a 4779 750 Double Pumper.
One with 4 corner idle adjustments.------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA & SS/MA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,'03,'04 &'05
First NHRA & IHRA 289 automatic Superstock Mustang in the TENS 06-99
First SS/MA in the TENS 04-03
IHRA division 5 Superstock Champion
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28 The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
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JJonesy99
Journeyman Posts: 43
From: Lakewood, CO USA
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 12:28 AM
Is the Demon better than the edlebrock in performance? I understand the holley is overall the best
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Bloose
Gearhead Posts: 700
From: Milwaukee, WI
Registered: Dec 2001
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posted 07-07-2005 01:18 AM
I have a Mighty Demon 650 on my 289. I am very happy with it. I think performance wise the Demon and Holley would be very close. They are very simular in design and operation with most small parts interchanging. The Demon has nicer air inlets, a billet base and billet metering plates. Most if not all tuning advice is interchangable. I think most of the dislike of Demons hinge around customer service, which I agree is not very good. Other than CS my Demon works great and I have no complaints. HTH,
B-loose
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rdinmv
Gearhead Posts: 149
From: orange county CA
Registered: Feb 2004
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posted 07-07-2005 01:26 AM
I can tell you absolutely the demon will blow away the edelbrock. After I removed my holley projection in anticipation of a stroker, I put my edelbrock 750 on my 351w (hyd roller,TW heads,try y-s etc..) I spent many hours changing jets,metering rods,springs,pupm shot to where it ran best and it still was rich in some spots, I bought a speeddemon 650 vac secondary off ebay and bolted it on, set idle and it runs way better right out of the box than my "tuned" edelbrock in fact its the closest thing to my holley TBI in throttle response and power and I'm sure I could dial it and make 10-25 more hp easy.I have run carters,holleys,edelbrocks and demons and the demon was the most impressive out of the box. Yea you can but the "designer"carbs for alot of money and they are great, holley HP series is definetly good but for the money I'd take a demon any day especially now that they have the "idle ease" circuit. Look at all the dyno shops,crate motors etc.... they all use demons. there 's a 393 build on enginemasters and they took a 1400.00 winston cup designer holley and a 523.00 demon and the demon beat it by 18 ft lbs and lost by 1/2 hp but also gave better economy. Yes there are some bad demons, just like bad holleys,edelbrocks and all the rest but for the money my opinion is there is no better carb. See this wicked windsor in a box pt 1 and 2 http://www.popularhotrodding.com/enginemasters/articles/ford/smallblock
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 26575
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 07-07-2005 09:21 AM
quote:
Originally posted by rdinmv:
[B]I Look at all the dyno shops,crate motors etc.... they all use demons.B]
Really?
 ------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA & SS/MA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,'03,'04 &'05
First NHRA & IHRA 289 automatic Superstock Mustang in the TENS 06-99
First SS/MA in the TENS 04-03
IHRA division 5 Superstock Champion
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28 The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
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CometGT1974
Gearhead Posts: 399
From: Asheville, NC USA
Registered: Jan 2002
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posted 07-07-2005 12:48 PM
I think the northerners are mad that a good ol southern boy developed a good carburetor!!That's my story and i'm stickin to it!!  j/k Well, I think Barry Grant is a southern boy....... [This message has been edited by CometGT1974 (edited 07-07-2005).]
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JJonesy99
Journeyman Posts: 43
From: Lakewood, CO USA
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 01:03 PM
So what you guys are saying that I'm really not getting the performance out of my 408w using an edelbrock? If I swith to demon I'll get better performance but if I get a Holley DP I'll get the best performance? Is the Demon & Holley a hard carb to tune?Jason ------------------
66' stang, 408W, C4, 4.11 gears, 12.08 1/4 @113mph, DAILY DRIVER
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BlueMule
Gearhead Posts: 1500
From: Kent Island, MD USA
Registered: Sep 2002
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posted 07-07-2005 01:08 PM
quote:
Originally posted by CometGT1974:
...
Well, I think Barry Grant is a southern boy....... [This message has been edited by CometGT1974 (edited 07-07-2005).]
Closer to New York is where he's from. ------------------
-Paul 70 Mach1 351C/FMX
79 Ranchero GT 302 smogger/C4
97 Expedition XLT 5.4
00 SVT f150 Lightning 4149 of 4966 Born on: 06/26/2000 'If you're not the lead dog, the view never changes.'
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CometGT1974
Gearhead Posts: 399
From: Asheville, NC USA
Registered: Jan 2002
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posted 07-07-2005 02:56 PM
Well, he lived in Georgia when he developed the Demon line of carbs so I guess they are southern bred carburetors!!!  Actually I think Holley and Demon both make great carb's, some of my good friends have great luck with the HP series and I have had great success with my Race Demon. Both are better than Edelbrock for performance!!
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prostreeter
Journeyman Posts: 91
From: littleton,co
Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 05:08 PM
get a holly 950hp and you and your motor will never look back.I just tried a 1050 dominator on my stroked cleveland and got into the high 11's
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JJonesy99
Journeyman Posts: 43
From: Lakewood, CO USA
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 05:36 PM
Prostreete: do you really think I need a 950 holley with our thin air up here in Denver? That seems like a lot of carb. Plus my motor is only 10.4/1 compression, FYIJason ------------------
66' stang, 408W, C4, 4.11 gears, 12.08 1/4 @113mph, DAILY DRIVER
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prostreeter
Journeyman Posts: 91
From: littleton,co
Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 08:50 PM
What type of heads are you using?
What's the CC volumn?
Running race or pump gas.We tend to need a little more up here than the rest of the people down lower elevations.What size jets are you using and is there a power valve?
I had a holley 1000hp and tried a 1050 dominator and it's just what the motor needed to get into the 11's.
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prostreeter
Journeyman Posts: 91
From: littleton,co
Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 08:55 PM
BTW Jason,anything would be better than an edelbrock.I've had friends try the mighty and race demon and everybody goes back to holley.
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JJonesy99
Journeyman Posts: 43
From: Lakewood, CO USA
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 09:30 PM
Prostreeter: I have vivtor jr heads, 91 octane. I ran 12.08 two weeks ago at club clash; 8th run with new motor. So I was thinking maybe the speed demon would get me into the 11's. I just wanna time slip that says 11's. I'm clue less on the tunning of the holley or a demon, thats why i'm kinda scared to change. ------------------
66' stang, 408W, C4, 4.11 gears, 12.08 1/4 @113mph, DAILY DRIVER
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Built351c
Gearhead Posts: 127
From: Big Lake, MN
Registered: Dec 2001
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posted 07-07-2005 09:36 PM
Use the Demon. You will not look back. If you get a chance to try a holley down the road do it. Untill then put the Demon on and feel the difference. You might have to look in the mirror to see the smile wrapped around your head. I know I did when I switched from a predator to a Demon.
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prostreeter
Journeyman Posts: 91
From: littleton,co
Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 07-07-2005 09:46 PM
Jason,
once you get a holley tuned into your motor it's pretty much trouble free.What's your 60'time? You dont have much to go to get an 11sec slip to keep in your wallet.for every 0.1 off your 60' is 0.15 on the big end.my thoughts,get rid of the edelbrock and get a holley tuned in properly and you'll be right where you want to be.Good luck.BTW......did you go to all ford day? Damn there was some fast fords out there.I did'nt run too well.Thought my trans was slipping as my et's suxed.Come to find out the problem I had was a cracked plug and one split wire.I was loosing at least 100hp!!
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 2512
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 07-07-2005 10:25 PM
An Edelbrock is not enough carb for a hotrod 408. You'll see big gains with a Holley HP950, or something similar.Good Luck! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 26575
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 07-07-2005 11:07 PM
quote:
Originally posted by CometGT1974:
I think the northerners are mad that a good ol southern boy developed a good carburetor!!That's my story and i'm stickin to it!! j/k Well, I think Barry Grant is a southern boy....... [This message has been edited by CometGT1974 (edited 07-07-2005).]
And.....Barry Grant is such a handsome devil too!
 ------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA & SS/MA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,'03,'04 &'05
First NHRA & IHRA 289 automatic Superstock Mustang in the TENS 06-99
First SS/MA in the TENS 04-03
IHRA division 5 Superstock Champion
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28 The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
IP: Logged |
steve'66
Gearhead Posts: 9184
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000
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posted 07-07-2005 11:22 PM
We run a 850 Holley DP'r on the 408w.I run a 830 Holley HP on the other car w/ 440 c.i.'s. I think the HP's are less CFM's than their name implies. Like a 830 HP is really a hotrodded 750, and the 950HP is a hotrodded 850. Am I right? SteveW
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steve'66
Gearhead Posts: 9184
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000
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posted 07-07-2005 11:25 PM
BTW Both carbs have been flawless! They are great carbs. The Edelbrock carbs scare me 'cause I don't know them. I know Holleys and am very comfy with them.
Everything including brain surgery is easy, if you know how. SteveW
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JJonesy99
Journeyman Posts: 43
From: Lakewood, CO USA
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 07-08-2005 01:15 AM
Thanks everyone for the great advice. I'm sold on the Holley carb but confused about the HP & DP. Whats the difference? Also I've had three different CFM carbs suggested to me a 750, 850, and 950. Remeber this car is street driven in Denver (6500ft). More or less CFM better, but run every weekend at bandimere.Thanks Jason ------------------
66' stang, 408W, C4, 4.11 gears, 12.08 1/4 @113mph, DAILY DRIVER
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JJonesy99
Journeyman Posts: 43
From: Lakewood, CO USA
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 07-08-2005 01:32 AM
Prostreeter: I didnt make it to ford day, i was in NE. There always seems to be fast fords that i've never seen before come to that event. When do you plan on heading back up to the track?My best 60' is 1.72 (10" 3000 stall, foot braked to about 2400) ------------------
66' stang, 408W, C4, 4.11 gears, 12.08 1/4 @113mph, DAILY DRIVER
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prostreeter
Journeyman Posts: 91
From: littleton,co
Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 07-08-2005 08:45 AM
I think the 950hp is well suited for your big inch motor.like steve66 said,the 950hp is really an 850,perfect for your car.You'll have to experiment with jet size.I run 92 infront/96 in rear.We need more jetting up here.I'm taking my car to julesburg on sunday.The elevation is abt 4k.What are you doing this afternoon jason?
All the hotrodders are getting together at burger king at kipling @ jewell.
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JCQuinn@work
Gearhead Posts: 852
From: Lakewood, CO, USA
Registered: Jun 2001
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posted 07-08-2005 11:05 AM
I used to run a much modified 780 Holley on a 289 around Denver.I don't think you need to worry about too much carb on a 408. Just make sure you have the gearing right. John Oh also, if you buy a new carb it should run fine right out of the box. [This message has been edited by JCQuinn@work (edited 07-08-2005).]
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JJonesy99
Journeyman Posts: 43
From: Lakewood, CO USA
Registered: Jan 2005
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posted 07-08-2005 11:28 AM
Prostreeter: I get off work @6 so i'll try to make it buy. I work off of wads/jewell. I'll look for ya. What kinda car is it again?John: When you say the "right gearing", what do you mean by that? I have 4.11 gears in the rear now. Is that enough? Its good to see a few Colorado people on this site Jason ------------------
66' stang, 408W, C4, 4.11 gears, 12.08 1/4 @113mph, DAILY DRIVER
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prostreeter
Journeyman Posts: 91
From: littleton,co
Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 07-08-2005 01:40 PM
Jason,
I think what john means is a gear ratio around 4.56
I have that in my car now but I need to go around 4.88's.Mine is not a daily driver and if you go to higher gears it wont be street friendly....god knows mine is nowhere street happy!
I'll be at the cruise tonite if there's no rain or high winds.You know how it gets here in the afternoons.You wont miss my car....the only red prostreet mach 1 in town.see ya there.
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Bloose
Gearhead Posts: 700
From: Milwaukee, WI
Registered: Dec 2001
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posted 07-09-2005 04:31 AM
I'm no carb expert but DP is for Double Pumper i.e. no vacuum secondaries and accelerator pumps for front and rear float bowls. HP is a series of carbs from Holley which I beleive stands for High Performance. The HP carbs are their higher end carbs for more race oriented motors, much like the Mighty and Race Demon carbs from BG.HTH,
B-loose
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