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Author
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Topic: What do 351c 4v's like the best for total timing?
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f100cleveland
Gearhead Posts: 328
From: St. James, MN
Registered: Sep 2004
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posted 04-12-2005 12:14 AM
   
I know the best, and most accurate way to find the best total timing is on a dyno, but I'm guessing that there is a small ballpark figure that they like. So, you guys that have flat top pistons with closed chamber 4v's, what do your 351c's like the best?------------------
1982 Ford F100 2wd Shortbox. Powered by a 357 Cleveland w/ closed chamber 4v's and a Funnelweb. Full Roller c-6 trans with Gear Vendors Overdrive and 4.86 geared Detroit Locker equipped 9" rear. 1982 F100 351c 4v 1977 F150 460 Burnout Truck
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clevelandstyle
Gearhead Posts: 1098
From: Connersville, IN
Registered: Jul 2001
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posted 04-12-2005 12:55 AM
Mine likes 36-38 total.------------------
Ben
Grabber Green '70 Mach I 351C 4V
Robbin Egg Blue '79 Fairmont 408C 4V, 10.50 127 MPH
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Hans olsson
Gearhead Posts: 670
From: Sweden
Registered: Apr 2000
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posted 04-12-2005 11:13 AM
Locked out at 40.------------------
- VIN 1F05M139343
- 71 Mach 1 Ram-Air
- 351C 4V 285 HP
- F-G/Stock Aut
- Stockers are way cool!
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Rustang
Gearhead Posts: 775
From: Clarion PA
Registered: Nov 2000
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posted 04-12-2005 11:59 AM
With small domes mine liked 42. One time, on a hot humid day. I screwed up between passes and accidentally set the timing to something crazy like 48 and it picked up!I think Kidd said he had some similar experiences with the cleveland stuff in humid weather ------------------
'68 mustang 351 clevor- 10.92@124
'67 Stang, 351W -11.18@118
'69 351C Torino-14.90@100
'78 Pickup 351W-15.56@88
'79 Pickup 460 ET=??
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JCQuinn@work
Gearhead Posts: 850
From: Lakewood, CO, USA
Registered: Jun 2001
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posted 04-12-2005 12:00 PM
The best way to find the correct total timing is at the track. Years ago I was racing in Stock eliminator and someone talked me into letting him dyno tune my 289. One hundred dollars later the dyno tuned car ran 2 tenths slower, I put the timing and jetting back to what the dragstrip told me and got the two tenths back.What works best on the dyno and what works best at the track are usually not the same. John
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 26513
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 04-12-2005 01:22 PM
quote:
Originally posted by JCQuinn@work:
The best way to find the correct total timing is at the track. Years ago I was racing in Stock eliminator and someone talked me into letting him dyno tune my 289. One hundred dollars later the dyno tuned car ran 2 tenths slower, I put the timing and jetting back to what the dragstrip told me and got the two tenths back.What works best on the dyno and what works best at the track are usually not the same. John
AMEN to that, although I have found that optimum timing, once found never varies.  ------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA & SS/MA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,'03,'04 &'05
First NHRA & IHRA 289 automatic Superstock Mustang in the TENS 06-99
First SS/MA in the TENS 04-03
IHRA division 5 Superstock Champion
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28 The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
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cracing
Gearhead Posts: 370
From: Saltillo Miss. USA
Registered: Jan 2002
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posted 04-12-2005 01:45 PM
You nailed it Alex, unless there are changes made, like compression ratio etc. Even then it wont be far from it. I have found big port iron head Fords like 30-34. They will run faster with more but seem to run the numbers more consistantly with less. [This message has been edited by cracing (edited 04-12-2005).]
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JCQuinn@work
Gearhead Posts: 850
From: Lakewood, CO, USA
Registered: Jun 2001
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posted 04-12-2005 04:22 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Moneymaker:
AMEN to that, although I have found that optimum timing, once found never varies.
I mostly agree, but racing in Division 5 the tracks vary from 6000 feet elevation to around 2000 feet so sometimes the car likes things a little different. In Denver where there is no air things burn a little slower. Back when cars had distributors the standard practice when you moved here was bump the timing 2 degrees. John
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lawless
Gearhead Posts: 444
From: Richmond, VA
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 04-12-2005 05:46 PM
quote:
Originally posted by JCQuinn@work:
Years ago I was racing in Stock eliminator and someone talked me into letting him dyno tune my 289.
That someone wouldn't be from the "Carburetor Shop" by any chance? Their dyno is much lower in elevation than Bandimere. Don't ask me how I know
Chris
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 26513
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 04-12-2005 06:38 PM
I heard it was closer to 4 or 5 John. ------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA & SS/MA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,'03,'04 &'05
First NHRA & IHRA 289 automatic Superstock Mustang in the TENS 06-99
First SS/MA in the TENS 04-03
IHRA division 5 Superstock Champion
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28 The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
IP: Logged |
f100cleveland
Gearhead Posts: 328
From: St. James, MN
Registered: Sep 2004
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posted 04-12-2005 07:37 PM
Hey Alex, where would you start with the total timing? I know you used to race Clevelands so you know them pretty good.------------------
1982 Ford F100 2wd Shortbox. Powered by a 357 Cleveland w/ closed chamber 4v's and a Funnelweb. Full Roller c-6 trans with Gear Vendors Overdrive and 4.86 geared Detroit Locker equipped 9" rear. 1982 F100 351c 4v 1977 F150 460 Burnout Truck
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Moneymaker
Administrator Posts: 26513
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99
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posted 04-12-2005 07:59 PM
40------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator NHRA/IHRA/SRA member and licensed Superstock driver
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA & SS/MA National Record Holder '00,'01,'02,'03,'04 &'05
First NHRA & IHRA 289 automatic Superstock Mustang in the TENS 06-99
First SS/MA in the TENS 04-03
IHRA division 5 Superstock Champion
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28 The Barry of BarrysGrrl Quote #1: "I never met a magazine mechanic I liked."
Quote #2: "Make sure brain is in gear before engaging mouth!"
Quote #3: "If you can't run with the big dogs, stay on the porch!"
www.moneymakerracing.com
IP: Logged |
kid vishus
Gearhead Posts: 6220
From: middle of NC
Registered: Oct 2000
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posted 04-12-2005 08:11 PM
quote:
Originally posted by f100cleveland:
So, you guys that have flat top pistons with closed chamber 4v's, what do your 351c's like the best?
I don't know, I've never run flat tops with cc heads. But all the 100% cleveland race motors I have built all have worked best with 40*+ of timing. The last one ran fastest with 46* (might have went faster with more, but putting more in it kind of frightened me.) On the other hand, my 402" hi-compression clevor runs fastest with only 32* of timing.
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JCQuinn@work
Gearhead Posts: 850
From: Lakewood, CO, USA
Registered: Jun 2001
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posted 04-13-2005 03:11 PM
quote:
Originally posted by lawless:
That someone wouldn't be from the "Carburetor Shop" by any chance? Their dyno is much lower in elevation than Bandimere. Don't ask me how I know
Chris
This was years before the "Carburetor Shop" existed. It was a local guy with a dyno right here in Denver.
John
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JCQuinn@work
Gearhead Posts: 850
From: Lakewood, CO, USA
Registered: Jun 2001
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posted 04-13-2005 03:18 PM
quote:
Originally posted by Moneymaker:
I heard it was closer to 4 or 5 John.
NHRA likes to claim it to be lower but the elevation of Denver is 5280 and the town is way lower than the track. From the grandstand you have a nice view of the town if you look down. Most of the altimeters that I have heard of peg it between 6 and 7 thousand feet. The first couple of years when Bandimere's had their National meets they were Sports-nationals (I was in heaven). I was pitted next to Bob Newberry (back when he ran comp) and overheard him telling his pit crew that "the motor must be broke" when he made his first time trial. I just smiled to myself. John
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