|
Author
|
Topic: 393 Stroker
|
mainer
Gearhead Posts: 157
From: Bryant Pond, Maine
Registered: Sep 2003
|
posted 09-22-2003 09:27 PM
   
I'm in the process of evaluating a new motor for my new to me 68 coupe. Came across this 351w/393 short block for $1899. Goal is to build a mid 12's streatable machine without breaking the bank.The parts spec looks pretty good for the price. Any opinions appreciated. I'm pretty close to pulling the trigger and looking for reasons I shouldn't. don
A Well Seasoned Ford 351W Block - Vatted, Magnafluxed, Blue-Printed, Bored .030 Over, Decked.005, Brass Freeze Plugs, Clevite Cam Bearings Installed, and Painted Ford Blue
NEW SCAT 9000 Series Premium Cast Crankshaft - 3.850" Stroke (650HP 7500RPM Capacity) Fully Rebuilt Heat Treated 351w 5.956 Connecting Rods (500HP Capacity) - 3/8" ARP Rod Bolts NEW SpeedPro Hypereutectic Pistons with 4 Valve Reliefs - Comp Ratio Varies Depending On Heads, Usually Between 9:1 and 10:1 NEW ARP High Performance Main Bolts NEW Hastings Chrome Moly Piston Rings NEW Clevite 77 Trimetal Engine Bearings Used Throughout The Complete Rotating Assembly Has Been Precision Balanced to Accept a 28.2oz. Harmonic Balancer and Flywheel
IP: Logged |
kid vishus
Gearhead Posts: 6405
From: middle of NC
Registered: Oct 2000
|
posted 09-22-2003 09:40 PM
quote:
Originally posted by mainer:
Fully Rebuilt Heat Treated 351w 5.956 Connecting Rods (500HP Capacity) - 3/8" ARP Rod Bolts
Here's the weak link in that kit. I would see if there is an upgrade for better rods. I would much rather see an Eagle rod in that combo than a factory "rebuilt" rod.
Also, their claim of 650 hp for the crank is out of whack too. KK's brother broke a Scat cast crank in his 408 and his motor at that time might have been making 600 hp and he was only turning it 6400 rpm.
But for what you are doing, it will be fine. I would worry about the rods though.
IP: Logged |
FastFordAndy
Journeyman Posts: 45
From: Glendora, Ca.
Registered: Nov 2000
|
posted 09-23-2003 01:40 AM
The rods are a bit of concern but I would be more likely to replace those hyperexplosive pistons first. The other problem through experience is it is best to at least nuetral balance the front of the crank. I have broken a couple of 4"/4.1" cast cranks that were not internally balanced and no problems after going internal. Also it is not really precisionly balanced unless the balancer and flywheel come with it.
IP: Logged |
mainer
Gearhead Posts: 157
From: Bryant Pond, Maine
Registered: Sep 2003
|
posted 09-23-2003 09:17 AM
Thanks for the info. Any suggestions on substitue rods? There seems to be conflicting opinions on the Hypereutectic Pistons. Without going forged is there a better option? don
IP: Logged |
Maverick Mike
Journeyman Posts: 65
From: IL USA
Registered: Nov 2000
|
posted 09-23-2003 09:37 AM
MAINER....I AM USING PRETTY MUCH THE SAME COMBO. I AM USING THE CHEAPER ROD ALSO, AS AT THE TIME OF PURCHASE I WAS A LITTLE STRAPPED FOR $$$. I SPIN IT 6500 EVERY WEEKEND AND HAVE HAD ZERO PROBLEMS. KV IS RIGHT ABOUT THE EAGLE RODS BEING THE WAY TO GO, BUT DONT BE AFRAID OF THESE RODS EITHER. JUST MAKE SURE YOU HAVE A BALANCE JOB DONE BY A TOP NOTCH SHOP. I AM ALSO RUNNING THE SAME SPEED PRO PISTONS (CP336) AND HAVE HAD NO PROBLEMS THERE EITHER. ALEX DID TURN ME ON TO SOME COMETIC HEAD GASKETS, THEY ARE A LITTLE MORE BUT WELL WORTH IT. IF YOU WANT MY 2 CENTS ON THESE STROKER PROJECTS, ITS ALL IN THE CAM & HEADS. I'M RUNNING A SET OF EDELBROCK PERFORMER RPM #6026 WITH STAGE 2 PORTING AND COMP 306S SOLID LIFT CAM WITH 260 @50 AND 592 LIFT. I HAVE A VICTOR JR. AND A HOLLEY PRO SERIES HP 830.
GETTING A GOOD TRANNY ALSO WILL MAKE YOUR COMBO LAST. I HAVE A JPT C4 WITH A BRAKE AND A COAN 4800 STALL. ALEX IS RIGHT ABOUT THESE THINGS, WITH A LITLLE TLC..THESE JPT'S ARE GREAT.
IF YOUR GONNA PUT YOUR COMBO IN A 3200 lb CAR I DONT THINK HIGH 12'S ARE OUT OF REACH FOR YOU. BUT AS I SAID, YOU'LL NEED SOME GOOD HEADS. GOOD LUCK
MIKE ------------------
91 Mustang 398 stroker w/JPT c4
1.41 60ft
best 1/8 6.915 on motor...on bottle 1/8 6.36 100 horse shot
IP: Logged |
kid vishus
Gearhead Posts: 6405
From: middle of NC
Registered: Oct 2000
|
posted 09-23-2003 05:40 PM
Even if it weighs 3400 lbs, and only has a 3.73 gear it should run deep into the 12's. High elevens should be within reach with some tuning.KK's car weighs in excess of 3200 lbs, has a 4.11 gear, runs on pump gas, is only 357 inches, is using stock heads and the 1/4 equivalent of it's current 1/8 mile times is in the 12.20-12.30 range. I would be seriously disappointed if a 393 wouldnt push it into the 11's. I think KK's car would get there now if it had some good aftermarket heads.
IP: Logged |
Maverick Mike
Journeyman Posts: 65
From: IL USA
Registered: Nov 2000
|
posted 09-23-2003 08:52 PM
I AGREE...I DIDNT MEAN TO PUT HIGH 12'S IN THE POST ABOVE. I MEANT 12'S AS IN MID TO LOW 12'S.
I WENT 11.03 @ 121 AT GATEWAY IN ST. LOUIS DURING THE MOBIL 1 FORD EVENT THIS YEAR, AND THAT WAS WITH 2100 FEET OF AIR. LAST MONTH AT CORDOVA IT WENT 10.98 @ 122 WITH MUCH BETTER AIR. I AM ALSO ONLY RUNNING A 4.10 GEAR IN MY 8.8 SO I CAN RUN BOTH 1/8 AND 1/4 TRACKS. I WOULD LOVE TO RUN A 4.56 TO HELP THOSE 60 FOOT TIMES BUT THEN IT WOULD BE SREAMING AT ME IN THE 1/4. SO I SETTLED FOR A HAPPY MEDIUM. ------------------
91 Mustang 398 stroker w/JPT c4
1.41 60ft
best 1/8 6.915 on motor...on bottle 1/8 6.36 100 horse shot
IP: Logged |
mainer
Gearhead Posts: 157
From: Bryant Pond, Maine
Registered: Sep 2003
|
posted 09-30-2003 09:41 AM
So, I'm still waffling on whether to go with this setup.I talked with the shop about the piston/rod concerns and they offered the following options: For $400 more:
Probe Forged FPS Pistons, Eagle SIR lightWeight Forged Rods For $600 more:
Hawks Racing nodular iron crankshaft, Hawks
Racing forged 4340 H-Beam 6.2" rods, and premium forged Probe SRS flat-top pistons. The extra cash isn't just parts, but the disassembly, rebalance etc of the 393 as it sits with the SpeedPro Hypereutectic pistons and rebuilt rods. One advantage of the hawks option is the longer rods but I don't know anything about hawks quality/durability. Thanks,
don
IP: Logged |
68DARKHORSE
Gearhead Posts: 445
From: Austin, Tx
Registered: Aug 2002
|
posted 09-30-2003 10:03 AM
Use H-beam rods only with a forged crank.The SIR rods can handle as much power as the nodular crank. The nodular crank will rev quicker and last longer with the lightweight SIR rods.
IP: Logged |
68DARKHORSE
Gearhead Posts: 445
From: Austin, Tx
Registered: Aug 2002
|
posted 09-30-2003 10:06 AM
SIR rods also require less grinding for clearance than H-beams.
IP: Logged |
mainer
Gearhead Posts: 157
From: Bryant Pond, Maine
Registered: Sep 2003
|
posted 09-30-2003 09:32 PM
I've opted for the middle option with the Probe Forged FPS Pistons, Eagle SIR lightWeight Forged Rods. The description someone else posted of their experience with a hawks crank didn't sound good. The whole kit:
A Well Seasoned Ford 351W Block - Vatted, Magnafluxed, Blue-Printed, Bored .030 Over, Decked.005, Brass Freeze Plugs, Clevite Cam Bearings Installed, and Painted Red SCAT 9000 Series Premium Cast Crankshaft - 3.850" Stroke Eagle SIR lightWeight Forged Rods - 3/8" ARP Rod Bolts Probe Forged FPS Pistons ARP High Performance Main Bolts Hastings Chrome Moly Piston Rings Clevite 77 Trimetal Engine Bearings Used Throughout Rebuilt harmonic balancer and flexplate (for $100, should I upgrade here?) NEW CompCams Extreme Energy XE284H Hydraulic Flat Tappet Camshaft - Duration at .050 is 240int and 246ex - Lift is .541int and .544ex Clevite Double Roller Timing Chain Melling High Volume Oil Pump with ARP Driveshaft Price is $2500 shipped across the country to Maine. The original block that this started from can't be used because of the piston differences so this one will start from scratch and get balanced with the balancer/flexplate that will be on the car. Next stop heads, intake and carb. I'm haven't built a v8 for 25 years and am a big time rookie trying to build hp on a budget. Any comments on the above choices appreciated (even if it makes me look stupid)  Thanks for all the feedback so far. don
IP: Logged |
Buster
Gearhead Posts: 1553
From: Hurricane alley
Registered: May 2002
|
posted 09-30-2003 09:59 PM
quote:
Eagle SIR lightWeight Forged Rods - 3/8" ARP Rod Bolts
Now, I only seen pic's of of both of these rods, Eagle and Ford MotorSport, although I will say the Ford MotorSport Cap screw rod looks MUCH better then the Eagle rod. The Ford MotorSport cap screw rods are around $325.00, I think and their full floating as well. More beef on the big end campaired to the Eagle.
*Edit* btw, I was talking about the Eagle I beam rods and not the H beam rods...
[This message has been edited by Buster (edited 10-01-2003).]
IP: Logged |
68 S-code GT
Gearhead Posts: 2962
From: Sayreville, NJ, US
Registered: Mar 2000
|
posted 11-19-2003 12:59 PM
Just curious as to what year block you are using?
IP: Logged |
Mustangsandmore Forums
