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Author Topic:   393 vs 408 Stroker
Kellxr7
Gearhead

Posts: 315
From: Canada
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 04-23-2003 12:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kellxr7   Click Here to Email Kellxr7     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
351W~Just wondering if I could get some opinions on which one would be more reliable for a car that sees alot of street time, I am assuming being the 393 has better rod ratio it puts less stress on the block but I am no expert, I am looking to build a high 400s or low 500s hp Street/strip engine, & it will see the odd 200 mile road trip. I am leaning towards the 393 just because I dont know alot about the 408. (Key word here is longevity.)

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68DARKHORSE
Gearhead

Posts: 417
From: Austin, Tx
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 04-23-2003 01:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 68DARKHORSE   Click Here to Email 68DARKHORSE     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
393 is alot less expensive to build but not if you use a power adder(then they are about the same).

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Kellxr7
Gearhead

Posts: 315
From: Canada
Registered: Mar 2003

posted 04-24-2003 08:31 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Kellxr7   Click Here to Email Kellxr7     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Any other ideas here? BTW I would be going naturally aspirated.

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67Coupster
Gearhead

Posts: 179
From: Fortson, GA, USA
Registered: Oct 2001

posted 04-24-2003 03:05 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 67Coupster   Click Here to Email 67Coupster     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I agree with Darkhorse on this one. The 393 would be cheaper than the 408 for the power levels your trying to achieve. 450 to 500 hp is not that hard to achieve with a 393 if the right parts are picked.

I drove mine on the street while I was breaking it in and didn't have any problems except drawing attention because of the loud exhaust. Since then it been all track time. Best so far 6.95 at 99 in the 1/8.

------------------
James
67 Coupe
393W, 4 Speed,

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N266fords
Gearhead

Posts: 1039
From: Spokane ,WA USA
Registered: Apr 2003

posted 04-24-2003 08:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for N266fords   Click Here to Email N266fords     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
i am building a 393 stroker for the street and strip i ordered from strokermotor.com check them out they are small company and the offer the best price for what you get and what they offer i got the forged nittrated crank h-beam rods special order low comp srp pistons for my vic jr heads not included sfi bal and flexplate clevitt 77h bearings balanced and all for 2300 not to bad for a balanced assembly to your door...It has not come yet i just ordered it waiting for the low comp pistons bummer lol

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steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 7226
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 04-24-2003 09:30 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I would choose a 393w for your application too. We have a 408w now and the 4" stroke is cool, but quite a bit of clearancing is required and you don't need that long of stroke for what you're doing.

SteveW

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68DARKHORSE
Gearhead

Posts: 417
From: Austin, Tx
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 04-24-2003 09:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 68DARKHORSE   Click Here to Email 68DARKHORSE     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
This is a quote from amsracing.com for a 408w.

SRP pistons J&E pistons.... need to know size... compression with 60cc 10.4 to 1
Eagle 3d H beam rods 4340 rods ..... with ARP bolts 8740 6.250 length
Sealed power file fit rings SPEED PRO
Federal Mogul race brgs or CL77 ,,,Mains, Rods
4340 Steel 4.000 stroke Eagle Crankshaft.... $1625.00
Balancing $135.00
Balancer Pioneer.... Hb351W 73.00
Flywheel FRA... 35.75
Frt on crank 20.10
Frt on components Parts 21.81
TOTAL>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> $1910.66

[This message has been edited by 68DARKHORSE (edited 04-24-2003).]

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68DARKHORSE
Gearhead

Posts: 417
From: Austin, Tx
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 04-24-2003 09:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 68DARKHORSE   Click Here to Email 68DARKHORSE     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
My total ended up being $1673.
I went with nodular crank and SIR I-beam rods since I will not use a power adder. A side benefit(aside from price) is the I-beams weigh less than the H-beams.

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Daniel Jones
Gearhead

Posts: 575
From: St. Louis, MO
Registered: Aug 99

posted 04-25-2003 12:38 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Daniel Jones   Click Here to Email Daniel Jones     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
> I am leaning towards the 393 just because I don't know alot about the 408.
> (Key word here is longevity.)

Longevity is directly related to RPM (load is a function of the square
of RPM) and to piston speed (a direct function of stroke). When Ford
increases stroke, they tend to also increase deck height and rod length
to preserve the rod ratio (shorter rods transfer more side load into
the cylinder walls). If you look at a 302 which has a deck height of
8.2" and a stroke of 3.0" and compare it to a 351C with a 9.2" deck
height and 3.5" stroke, you'll see Ford increased the deck height by
twice the stroke increase. A 351W has an even taller deck height of
9.5" than a Cleveland, giving more room for additional stroke or rod
length. The 3.85" stroke of the 0.030" over 393 Windsor strokers was
chosen for one reason: to keep the cost down using off-the-shelf 302
pistons and 351W rods. There are relatively inexpensive cranks and
rods available for 4.0" and 4.1" 351W strokers now so there are lots
of choices. The limiting factor is usually the pin height (a.k.a.
compression height) of the piston. You need enough room to keep a
reasonable ring pack. Assuming a zero deck, with a 4" stroke and 6"
rods, the stack height for a 351W stroker works out to be:

piston pin height = deck height - (rod length + crank stroke/2)
= 9.5 - (6.0 + 4.0/2)
= 1.5 inches

A lot of builders will go to a 6.2" rod:

= 9.5 - (6.2 + 4.0/2)
= 1.3 inches

or a 4.1" stroke and a 6.125" rod:
= 9.5 - (6.125 + 4.1/2)
= 1.325 inches

The typical 347 SBF strokers have pin heights in the 1.1" region and I'm
told that modular V8's have 1.2X pin heights, so all of the above pin
heights should be fine. I would use piston speed as a determining factor
and limit RPM as required by the stroke chosen. You'll need good race-type
aftermarket heads to feed all those cubes. A friend recently built a
street 418W with a 4.1" stroke crank and ported AFR 205 heads. It peaked
at 556 HP at only 5700 RPM.

Dan Jones

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68DARKHORSE
Gearhead

Posts: 417
From: Austin, Tx
Registered: Aug 2002

posted 04-25-2003 02:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 68DARKHORSE   Click Here to Email 68DARKHORSE     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Daniel Jones:
A friend recently built a
street 418W with a 4.1" stroke crank and ported AFR 205 heads. It peaked
at 556 HP at only 5700 RPM.

Dan Jones[/B]


What cam, please?
Alton

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Daniel Jones
Gearhead

Posts: 575
From: St. Louis, MO
Registered: Aug 99

posted 04-25-2003 05:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Daniel Jones   Click Here to Email Daniel Jones     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A custom Comp Cams hydraulic roller 244 @ 0.050", 0.600" lift, 110 LSA. Heads were ported by AFR, carb was a Race Demon, MSD-6AL ignition, Cobra headers and pipes,
Victor Jr. intake. Very streetable, at least in a 2500 lb Cobra replica.

Dan Jones

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