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Author Topic:   Considering solid roller
ZEATER
Gearhead

Posts: 180
From: Mount Pleasant,IA,USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 10-16-2002 03:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ZEATER   Click Here to Email ZEATER     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
428 10.6 comp ebrock heads pocket ported, blue thunder intake 850 holley tri y headers

Current cam Comp cams 292H hydraulic
292/292 244/244 @ .050 .56/.56 lift 110 lobe sep

Looking at Comp Cams 288R solid roller
292/292 248/248 @ .050 .645/.645 lift 110 lobe sep

Thought I would ask opinions from anyone who might have switched from hyd to solid roller or has some FE experience.

Currently showing 374 rear wheel horse on dyno 412 torque running best of 12.195 @ 111.40 on street driven car. (slicks at track though) Car is 4 speed so idle not a problem.

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 2831
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 10-16-2002 03:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Those FE's have a huge 1.76 rocker ratio. You don't need a solid roller to get plenty of valve acceleration. I'd probably just look into a decent flat tappet solid.

Comp has a nice series of 'max area' solids that are quick acting, are designed for fairly tight lash, and surprisingly don't go off the lift chart too bad when teamed up with the FE's rocker ratio. I'd look into those lobes, and have a cam custom ground with similar specs to the cam in your car now. I'd use similar specs, maybe a tad larger, and more exhaust timing. If you're running good gas and a 3.0" exhaust (free flowing) you might try tightening the lobe seperation to 108. Just don't go too big, or you'll lose that torque that's launching your car 'oh so well'.

Go to www.compcams.com and click on 'online catalog'. Then go to the lobe specifications, and find the 'max area' solids. These are fairly aggressive, and should be broken in carefully with only the outer springs.

Be sure to use a good rocker setup with end stands! The Erson is the best deal going, as the whole thing (ready to bolt onto the cylinder head) can be purchased from Summit for around $600. If you've already got good rockers, add-on end stands can be purchased from a number of vendors.

Solid rollers can be a pain for a street-type car. They are expen$ive as hell, and when used regularly, can fail. They are meant to be checked on and rebuilt regularly. If you let them go, they tend to fail at the worst possible time and send all sorts of schrapnel throughout the engine. This is why pro engine builders install screens in all the holes in the lifter valley's of solid roller engines. (I know guys, I'm sure some of you are exceptions to this rule... but there are FAR more solid roller than flat tappet failures.)

They are not a 'low maintainence' item. A quick acting flat tappet solid would work great in your car.

Good Luck!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

[This message has been edited by n2oMike (edited 10-16-2002).]

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ZEATER
Gearhead

Posts: 180
From: Mount Pleasant,IA,USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 10-16-2002 04:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ZEATER   Click Here to Email ZEATER     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks for the reply. Maybe I should just be happy with my curent set up. I have considered running exhaust dump outs or at least 3 inch to the mufflers. I just need something to push over into that 11 second area. I think with a perfect run I can hit 12.000 with what I have now.
Thanks again,
Steve

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jsracingbbf
Gearhead

Posts: 2954
From: Batesville,MS. , U.S.A.
Registered: Mar 2002

posted 10-16-2002 11:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for jsracingbbf   Click Here to Email jsracingbbf     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'm no expert on FE motors but Mike and you mentioned something about exhaust, 3 inch I believe. My question is this, are Tri Y headers the "good" thing to run on a Fe motor for a street/strip car? why couldn't you run some 4 tube full length say 1 7/8th primary into 3 or 3 1/2 inch collectors? Just my 02 cents but I think this may help. THEN run the exhaust cut outs at the strip.

------------------
Jerry Smith
69 Mustang Pro ET Drag
70 Mustang retired former footbrake car
"Crawfish are Lucky! they get their Heads Sucked and their tails eaten!"

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 2831
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 10-16-2002 11:44 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'd at least run 3" to a set of 3" mufflers, then weld some 3-bolt collector rings onto the muffler outlets.

This will allow you to attach and remove the tailpipes with the addition of some simple header reducers.

Removable tailpipes also make dropping the whole exhaust a piece of cake.

As for tailpipes, the $99/pair mandrel bent 2.5" flowmasters are the ONLY way to go. They flow great, look pretty, and are cheap!

Cutouts are also a great idea. Just, the above setup allows the car to be either open headers (without the weight of the exhaust), 3" pipe through the mufflers (sounds tough on the street), or muffled through the tailpipes (stealth, and family friendly mode) in one easy package! It only takes a few spins of the wrench to QUICKLY change the exhaust system with your mood.

Any decent sized pipe gets crushed all to h*ll in making those tight bends up and over the rear axle.

3.0" pipe should definitely put you into the 11's with you current combo. That healthy big block needs room to breathe!

Good Luck!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

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Dad Vishus
Gearhead

Posts: 1064
From: Moscow, Iowa, USA
Registered: Dec 2001

posted 10-17-2002 09:23 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dad Vishus   Click Here to Email Dad Vishus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Personally, I'd spend money on a free flowing exhaust system on that car first. A good set of full length headers with at least 2 inch primaries and 3 inch mufflers and pipes. 3 inch full length tailpipes could be a problem clearance wise, so I would consider dumping them out in front of the back tires. With the good mufflers available now, it shouldn't be all that noisy and would let the thing breathe.

3 chamber Flowmasters or Borlas don't hurt performance much and sound really good.

Just my .02

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ZEATER
Gearhead

Posts: 180
From: Mount Pleasant,IA,USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 10-17-2002 10:15 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for ZEATER   Click Here to Email ZEATER     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I am running 2 1/2 inch exhaust now into 3 chamber flowmaster mufflers then into flowmaster 2 1/2 inch tail pipes.
The dyno shop suggested the 3 inch at least to the mufflers. 3 inch after that would be tight and they thought the 2 1/2 would be fine due to cooler exhaust gases at that point.

Thanks for the suggestions.

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 2831
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 10-17-2002 11:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You've already got the mandrel bent flowmasters... Excellent!

All you have to do is buy a set of 3.0" mufflers and go back to the shop to have 3.0" exhaust run to em'.

Don't forget to flange the muffler outlets to make the tailpipes removable!

In addition to what I said above, removable tailpipes make the removal of the entire exhaust system a piece of cake... which not only comes in handy on race day, but also when work under the car needs done. Clutch and transmission jobs are MUCH nicer without the exhaust system in the way.

Plus, if you want to run the car at the track with the mufflers attached, it will run faster without the tailpipes. 3.0" pipe has 7.07 square inches of flow area, while 2.5" pipe only has an area of 4.91 square inches. I wouldn't feel comfortable restricting the exhaust flow that much.

Plus, as gases are released from the high pressure cylinder to the atmosphere, they expand (the science behind stepped headers) They might cool some by the time they get to the tailpipes, but if I were racing, those tailpipes would be coming off.

Good Luck!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

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Dad Vishus
Gearhead

Posts: 1064
From: Moscow, Iowa, USA
Registered: Dec 2001

posted 10-17-2002 11:09 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Dad Vishus   Click Here to Email Dad Vishus     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
What about good full length headers hooked to your present system then unbolt the collector flange and bolt back up to one side at the track. That opens up your exhaust and is fairly easy to do when you race it now and then.

I really think a good set of war pipes would make a big difference in your track performance.

Again, my .02

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ZEATER
Gearhead

Posts: 180
From: Mount Pleasant,IA,USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 10-17-2002 01:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ZEATER   Click Here to Email ZEATER     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I made an appointment to look at 3 inch exhaust at least to mufflers. I have to remember that with this car I am always making compromises since it is street driven and only raced a couple of times a year. I have a friend and with a similar combination with a step wilder cam and hooker super comp headers run open he only got 1 hp more on the same dyno so I shouldn't feel bad. I should be happy with a 12.19 but if we were always happy with our current performance what good would we be.

I appreciate the help and I'll let you know how things go.

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mustangboy
Gearhead

Posts: 1147
From: Ont, Canada
Registered: Mar 2002

posted 10-17-2002 04:57 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for mustangboy     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
ZEATER thought you might be interested in an old car craft article I found.67 fastback runs 11.80s at 118 mph.He is also using tri-ys with a 3 inch exhaust into three chamber flow masters.Here's his combo.428 .030 over 10.5:1 compression,cast heads with 2.135/1.75 valves and a blue thunder intake(heavily ported).Isky hydraulic camshaft,284 advertised duration and 602 lift.C-6 with 3000 converter and 4.30 gears.Uses rancho shocks and Cal-Tracs with a set of 26x10.5 MT ET streets.Engine makes 511hp @5250 and 556 ft/lbs torque @3500 rpms(flywheel hp).

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ZEATER
Gearhead

Posts: 180
From: Mount Pleasant,IA,USA
Registered: Aug 2001

posted 10-17-2002 05:33 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ZEATER   Click Here to Email ZEATER     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Combo is fairly similar. I have more duration but less lift. With 118 mph he must be pulling a lot more horse than I am at 111.
I'll try the 3 inch if we can make it fit all the way back and let everyone know how it works out.

Thanks for the info.

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