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Author Topic:   I finally got my heads flowed (n2oMike)
n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 1468
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 06-05-2002 08:29 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A buddy porting a set of his own heads wanted one of mine to go by... so I sent it to him. His part of the deal was to take it to a shop with a flowbench to get it flowed and ship it back...

Well, he came through, and here are the results...

I got these numbers from John, and was expecting a bit more from the intake... maybe it was the old valve job or how the heads were set up on the bench. :lol:

I know very little about how the flowbench was set up, only that the guy seemed pressed for time. I don't know if the intake opening was radiused with clay, or if the guy used a pipe on the exhaust. All I do know is that there were several years worth of abuse on the valve job... it was not fresh by any stretch of the imagination. The valves were 1.94" intake, 1.60 exhaust.

Intake -- Exhaust

.1 063 -- 050.9
.2 119 -- 101.3
.3 168 -- 132.8
.4 201 -- 157.1
.5 210 -- 175
.6 218 -- 176.6

My intake volume was 155cc. (stock is 126cc) Comparing to the best of the aftermarket competition, here are AFR's published numbers for their fully CNC ported non emission 165's...

intake -- exhaust

.1 ----- ----
.2 123 -- 118
.3 186 -- 153
.4 225 -- 178
.5 243 -- 185
.6 250 -- 191

As long as there is no significant shrouding, or the short turn isn't too messed up, larger vavles will flow more at lower lifts. They provide a much larger window... especially when they are only opened a small amount. However, opening the bowls up large enough for a 1.94" intake valve is QUITE risky. The metal get VERY thin when the WHOLE bowl is opened up to around that size. I'd say 351W valves (1.84" / 1.56") would be nice in a 289 head.

I might try widening the intake port floor as much as is practical before the short turn. (I didn't know this trick until after those heads were already finished and on the car)

The exhausts did surprisingly well. I guess my design there worked out pretty well.

If John wants to publish some pictures, that would be great... John, just the head up a tad first.

Do any of the rest of you have ported numbers for small block (especially 289) heads? If so, share them with us! I'm curious as to how these compare with the rest of the world.

Good Luck!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

[This message has been edited by n2oMike (edited 06-05-2002).]

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 1468
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 06-05-2002 09:24 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Here's a good site that has all sorts of small block flow data grabbed from various magazine articles. I can't stand for the validity of 'magazine' numbers, (or even my own) :lol: but, it doesn't look like I did too bad for a 'good ole boy' who's never even seen a flowbench in real life.

http://www.jason.fletcher.net/tech/flowdata/castiron.htm

Looks like my numbers came out quite a bit better than the 289 heads in the 400hp Joe Sherman 400hp 302 buildup... Here's a link to that article...

http://www.jason.fletcher.net/tech/sherman/sherman.htm

Comparing to the aftermarket, and seeing what Joe Sherman was able to do with his flow numbers, I guess it's a good thing we don't race flowbenches....

Fletch has a pretty good website. He runs the carbedmustang email list.

http://www.jason.fletcher.net

Good Luck!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

[This message has been edited by n2oMike (edited 06-05-2002).]

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 19611
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 06-05-2002 11:04 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Very close to yours Mike. C5AE-B castings near 230 @600 on the intake. 155 cc volume. What castings did you use?

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator/ non 65-66 Mustang owner sensitivity co-ordinator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00, '01, & '02
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Part time secret agent license #0089
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 1468
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 06-05-2002 07:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Going from memory, they are either C6AE or C6OE...

They are not the C5 heads like you use that never had a thermactor hump. Mine had the one in the upper corner that made the port all crooked. Your castings are my personal favorites... it's much easier to center the guide in the port with those.

I can double check the number and get back with you, if you wish.

Good Luck!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 19611
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 06-05-2002 08:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I'd be interested Mike as I am contemplating doing a 225 HP C6OE-M deal for next year with high compresion. The allowable intake volume is much less on the C6 head though so contemplation may be as far as it gets.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator/ non 65-66 Mustang owner sensitivity co-ordinator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00, '01, & '02
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Part time secret agent license #0089
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 19611
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 06-05-2002 08:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
LOL, or Dyno's Mike.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator/ non 65-66 Mustang owner sensitivity co-ordinator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00, '01, & '02
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Part time secret agent license #0089
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

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TomP
Gearhead

Posts: 4764
From: Delta BC Canada
Registered: Dec 99

posted 06-05-2002 11:20 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for TomP   Click Here to Email TomP     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Those exhaust ports have a ton of room for improvements if you aren't needing to keep the port in its stock location. i have a "buggered up" C6AE head that i raised the ports on. I tried all thise stuff in about 1983 or 4 when i still had my Pinto . The roof is at least 1/2" taller, i built the flange area up to extend above the Thermactor hump.The floor is welded up almost even with the bottoms of the header bolt holes. The width is almost into those bolt holes and the seats cut for 1.65" exhaust valves, leaving barely enough room for a 1.94" intake.

They'd flow good, but it's not practical nowadays. For the motor,i ended up raising the ports 1/4" up top and doing no welding. i used the 1.94/1.65 (460 exh.valves) combo and sleeved the pushrod holes and ported till it hit the sleeves. Of course after paying $800 at the machine shop for heads i did most of the work on myself.... we stopped at AR in Ventura on the way to the Winternats and saw the prototype drawings for Alan Roots "Pro 1" heads... which became the J-302's by the time they were available. I felt like a buncha money had been wasted, quickly sold 'em for $600 (tough to do!)before aftermarket heads hit the market.

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 19611
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 06-06-2002 12:03 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
BIG, HUGE, ASTRONOMICAL mistake to overly enlarge the exhuast ports on 289 heads. We have learned a lot over the last 9 years. Anyone want to buy some ported 289 heads with BIG raised or BIG round exhaust ports?

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator/ non 65-66 Mustang owner sensitivity co-ordinator

NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00, '01, & '02
Fleet of FoMoCo products including 88 ASC McLaren Mustang #28
Part time secret agent license #0089
Professional Manwhore
The Barry of BarrysGrrl

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 1468
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 06-07-2002 07:46 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
C6OE

The exhausts came out to 55cc, (which is pretty large for the stock head)

That crooked port is a little funky, but probably would have worked out just about as well (and done better in the lower lifts) if made a little smaller. I opened the thermactor boss side pretty much all the way out to where the port would be straight. It fits a FelPro #1415 gasket pretty well.

Good Luck!

------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220

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