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Author Topic:   Are two steps legal?
steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 3653
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-01-2001 06:46 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
In NHRA street class bracket racing. Summit's ET series, or Sears points Weds. night drags for the H.S. or street classes, is it legal? It's installed and works great, all hell breaks loose when you let go of that button. I added a toggle switch on the shift lever to arm the two step. Just want to be sure this is legal

Now I know a delay box and a line lock solenoid in the hydraulic clutch line isn't legal, but that would work reeeaal good!

SteveW

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Rory McNeil
Gearhead

Posts: 557
From: Surrey, B.C. Canada
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 07-02-2001 02:36 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rory McNeil   Click Here to Email Rory McNeil     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Steve, I`ve ran a 2 step on my 5 speed street car for years,no problems with Missions "sportsman" bracket, although I believe they are not allowed this year at the NHRA ET Finals. 2 steps are a godsend for a full tree stick car.

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68Mustang
Gearhead

Posts: 166
From: Auburn, AL
Registered: Feb 2001

posted 07-02-2001 10:26 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for 68Mustang     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just wondering what a two step is, never really been introduced to all the technicalities of drag racing? Thanks

Marshall

------------------
1968 302 5-spd Fastback, Modified
1965 Coupe
1981 F-150

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steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 3653
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-02-2001 11:01 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
A two step is a rev limiter. The second "step" is a limiter that is activated to control launch rpm's. So you can floor the gas, and the limiter holds the engine rpms to the set limit until you release a button. In our case the line-loc button releases the line-loc and the limiter.


NHRA Div 7 ET Rules specify "No electronics"

Wednesday Night Rules specify "Throttle stops, delay boxes, and other electronic devices of that nature are not permitted"

So what I need is a clarification of what NHRA's definition of electronics is.

SteveW

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denny
Journeyman

Posts: 32
From: Northfield NH USA
Registered: Jul 2000

posted 07-02-2001 08:01 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for denny   Click Here to Email denny     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
They are not allowed in NHRA division one Thats why I stopped bracket racing and moved to stock class racing. I have tried some crazy stuff to set the startingline RPM but nothing was as successful as the 2 step. When I do bracket race in no electronics I put a 6800 chip in and leave at that RPM. Things go much better when I can leave in the 5000 - 5600 rpm range though.

------------------
D French
67 427 Fairlane(A/SA) 73 Mustang 351c

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steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 3653
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-03-2001 10:32 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks Denny!

I appreciate your input. I don't hear two steps in the street class at our track either, Div 7. I might have to go back to the fast idle solenoid for the ET finals. I know a couple people getting away with those.

SteveW

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 11493
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 07-03-2001 12:42 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Two steps are NOT legal in the street classes????? Really? Since when? (remember, I don't bracket race much)

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator
NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00 & '01
Fleet of FoMoCo products
Moneymaker Bio
US Class Nationals link

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steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 3653
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-03-2001 12:53 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Any idea how to get NHRA's definition of "electronics" ?

Thanks,

SteveW

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Rory McNeil
Gearhead

Posts: 557
From: Surrey, B.C. Canada
Registered: Nov 2000

posted 07-03-2001 01:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Rory McNeil   Click Here to Email Rory McNeil     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I think 2 steps in the NHRA street classes are a track rules item, but as of 2001 they are not allowed at the ET finals events.I`m not sure of the reason.

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ciscokid
Journeyman

Posts: 20
From: Cleveland, TN
Registered: Jul 2001

posted 07-03-2001 02:18 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for ciscokid     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The NHRA 2001 rule book, section 1A-8, page 25, under "Ignition", says that "Starting line and/or "high side" rev limiters permitted." Of course they also give individual tracks freedom to change the local rules as they please.

I don't think that NHRA classifies two-steps as "electronics". It looks like, in general, when they talk about "electronics" they are talking about "delay devices" "computers" "data recorders" etc. In section 8:2 of the General Regulations where they talk about delay devices in categories that prohibit delay devices, they imply that two-steps are not considered a delay device and even give instructions on how the two-step should be wired.

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steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 3653
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-03-2001 03:17 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Cisco,

Thanks for that and welcome to M&M!

I e-mailed our track (Sears Point) I'll let you know their ruling.


SteveW

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 11493
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 07-03-2001 05:31 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Welcome to M&M Cisco !

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator
NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00 & '01
Fleet of FoMoCo products
Moneymaker Bio
US Class Nationals link

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steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 3653
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-19-2001 08:08 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I received this e-mail today from the administrator of Sears Point Raceway.

"Steve,

RPM controllers and electric solenoids are legal in all classses as long as they are
active on the starting line only.

Glad we could clear that up for you.

Georgia Seipel. "


SteveW

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Gearhead
Gearhead

Posts: 1645
From: Vancouver Island, Great Wet North
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-19-2001 08:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gearhead   Click Here to Email Gearhead     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Just wondering how you would be able to get a good burnout in the box with a two-step that is tied into the line-lock button as well. Wouldn't it be that when you set the line lock to do the burnout you would then also have the 2nd step limiter engaged? How you would do a good 6000 rpm burnout in that case (other than doing the old clutch/brake dance)?

Sorry if this is a stupid question... just trying to learn for when I start building my own drag car!

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Cheers,
Ian
M&M Member #395
-------------------
'79 Mustang Indy 500 Pace Car
Ian's Pace Car Website
Vancouver Island Mustang Association Website
Indy Pace Car Registry of Mustangs Official Website

"If you get to thinking you are someone of some importance and influence, just try ordering another persons dog around." - Author Unknown

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steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 3653
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-19-2001 10:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ian,

I ran a hot wire from the line-lock button to a toggle switch on the shifter's lever, and on to the two step. You flip the switch after the burnout, and then the lower limit is set when the linelock is on. Just flip the toggle switch back before the next burnout. The toggle is low enough that it doesn't get in the way, but close enough that you can flip it with your index finger.

I/you could run this wire to a fast idle solenoid instead of the two-step to hold the launch rpms if the two step wasn't allowed.

SteveW

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Gearhead
Gearhead

Posts: 1645
From: Vancouver Island, Great Wet North
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-19-2001 10:28 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gearhead   Click Here to Email Gearhead     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Aha! Very trick... thanks for the info Steve.

Ian

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steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 3653
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 07-19-2001 01:09 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Anytime Ian.

SteveW

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