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Author Topic:   Intake/cam questions
Gearhead
Gearhead

Posts: 2164
From: Vancouver Island, Great Wet North
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 06-22-2001 12:23 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gearhead   Click Here to Email Gearhead     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ok, this isn't a strictly racing-related question, but I figured that you knowledgable folk would be able to help me out here... Is the 1983-85 factory 5.0 intake manifold essentially the same as a Edelbrock Performer? I'm planning on doing some mild upgrades to my motor in the future, but would like to keep the EGR and other emissions equipment so it at least appears to be stock. The Ebrock Performer seems to be the only other one out there that is EGR compatible, but if I can get a used intake system from an 83-85 GT that might be better for that "factory" look (and will be even cheaper). Just wondering how much of a difference there is between the two.

In addition I would be swapping in a cam with a bit more agressive profile. Currently I have what is basically a 82-84 HO cam, but with the 302 firing order. I was thinking of something like the Performer-Plus camshaft - .448/.472 w/ 270/280 duration (204/214 @ .050"), lobe seperation @ 112 degrees. Not enough? Keep in mind that I just want a mild performace street motor with good torque, not a killer strip engine.

Any comments or advice would be very much appreciated! Thanks in advance.

------------------
Cheers,
Ian
M&M Member #395
-------------------
'79 Mustang Indy 500 Pace Car
Ian's Pace Car Website
Vancouver Island Mustang Association Website
Indy Pace Car Registry of Mustangs Official Website

"If you get to thinking you are someone of some importance and influence, just try ordering another persons dog around." - Author Unknown

[This message has been edited by Gearhead (edited 06-22-2001).]

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steve'66
Gearhead

Posts: 6352
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 06-22-2001 01:19 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for steve'66   Click Here to Email steve'66     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Ian,

I sold one of the stock alum intakes last year for $30. They have smaller ports than a performer, but either of these manifolds are 5,000 to 5,500 rpm redlines. They would match the cam you are looking at though. Should work fine for what you want.

SteveW

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Gearhead
Gearhead

Posts: 2164
From: Vancouver Island, Great Wet North
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 06-22-2001 01:39 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gearhead   Click Here to Email Gearhead     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Thanks Steve. That's exactly where I would want redline to be. The bottom end is nice and fresh (about 5,000 miles on the rebuild), but I didn't have it balanced as I knew it was never going to be a screamer. 230-250 horsepower would be perfect for what I want.

Cheers,
Ian

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74merc
Gearhead

Posts: 759
From: Demopolis AL
Registered: Jun 99

posted 06-24-2001 06:29 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 74merc   Click Here to Email 74merc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
my cousin has that combo, less the Edel heads.
it doesn't make that much more torque over the stock cam.
I'd have to recommend the Comp Cams 268H.
268 adv dur, .456 lift, I think like 224 @ .050.
the Edelbrock cam doesn't pull as hard as we thought it would, its not that good of a cam, at the very least without the Edel heads.

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Gearhead
Gearhead

Posts: 2164
From: Vancouver Island, Great Wet North
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 06-25-2001 11:43 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gearhead   Click Here to Email Gearhead     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The 268H has a duration of 218 (int/exh.) @ .050, and lift of 0.456" (int./exh.) and lobe separation angle of 110 degrees. Looks like that might be a nice alternative.

Comp Cams also has the 265DEH dual pattern cam which looks like it would work with my proposed combo (211 int., 223 exh. @.050; .472" int., .486 exh. w/110 lobe separation).

Which would be a better choice, given my rather restrictive stock heads (although they have been cleaned up a bit)? Would a dual pattern have a bit of an advantage over the single pattern? Would my engine benefit more from the increased duration on the intake side of the 268H over the 265DEH, or would the higher lift and increased exhaust duration of the 265DEH compensate a bit for the restrictive exhaust ports (I will have shorty headers and full 2.5" dual exhaust on the car)?

Wow, this cam selection stuff is tricky!! Help me out here experts!! Thanks!

Cheers,
Ian

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 19686
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 06-26-2001 12:55 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Comp 270 H or S camshaft. The intake is junk!

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator
NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00 & '01
Fleet of FoMoCo products
Moneymaker Bio
US Class Nationals link

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Gearhead
Gearhead

Posts: 2164
From: Vancouver Island, Great Wet North
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 06-26-2001 02:40 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gearhead   Click Here to Email Gearhead     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
quote:
Originally posted by Moneymaker:
Comp 270 H or S camshaft. The intake is junk!


Would the 270 series be a bit much considering my compression ratio is around 8.5:1? How much more hassle is involved in using a solid cam (270S) over a hydraulic on the street? An I going to be spending lots of time adjusting the valvetrain? Also, I won't be reving the engine much over 5500 rpm as the bottom end hasn't been balanced, and I'm still using the stock balancer. The pistons have valve reliefs, but not sure how much lift they could accomodate (stock replacements, 0.040" over). Sorry, I'm still a rookie when it comes to cam selection so I want to be sure.

Ok, so I guess it'll be better to go for the Performer intake over a stock 85 unit. If i ground off the Edelbrock signature and painted it blue to match the rest of the engine it would still look pretty stock, I guess.

Thanks for your help with this everyone!

Cheers,
Ian

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 19686
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 06-26-2001 03:32 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
The valves will only need periodic (once every 3K miles) with good poly locks if you go with a solid lifter cam. The 270S or H is a very mild pee pee cam that works great in almost ALL SBF street applications. It works well with high or low compression. Get a better intake manifold for sure. Even a cast iron 289 or 302 4V intake will flow better than the late model aluminum one.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator
NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00 & '01
Fleet of FoMoCo products
Moneymaker Bio
US Class Nationals link

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Gearhead
Gearhead

Posts: 2164
From: Vancouver Island, Great Wet North
Registered: Mar 2000

posted 06-26-2001 03:52 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Gearhead   Click Here to Email Gearhead     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
LOL!! "mild pee pee cam"... I think that our definitions of "mild" may differ here.

Thanks for the advice Alex, I really do appreciate it. I'm just getting tired of the stock engine, and want a bit more get-up-and-go when I mash the loud pedal. This combo should make a nice little street performer. Now I just have to start collecting the components!

Cheers,
Ian

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 19686
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 06-26-2001 05:27 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Well, when you are used to .800+ lift roller cams, .499 is on the pee pee side.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator
NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00 & '01
Fleet of FoMoCo products
Moneymaker Bio
US Class Nationals link

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65driver
Gearhead

Posts: 101
From: Syracuse, NY, USA
Registered: Feb 2000

posted 06-26-2001 06:11 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 65driver   Click Here to Email 65driver     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Alex,
any experience with the Xtreme Energy cams from Comp? When you call them up and tell them what you are after, they recommend thier new Xtreme series. Any opinions or real world expierence with them?

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74merc
Gearhead

Posts: 759
From: Demopolis AL
Registered: Jun 99

posted 06-26-2001 07:12 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for 74merc   Click Here to Email 74merc     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
question about the 270H...
will stock rail type non adjustable heads have to be reworked to run it safely and consistantly?
I know its right on the limit...
I want to use it, but I'm pinchin pennies here...
me = broke.
me = getting raise and a new job tho.

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Moneymaker
Administrator

Posts: 19686
From: Lyons, IL, USA
Registered: May 99

posted 06-27-2001 06:54 PM     Click Here to See the Profile for Moneymaker   Click Here to Email Moneymaker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
I like extreme energy cams on a car by car application only. I have had good results with them as long as I make the choice. You can safley use the rail type rockers with a 270H as long as you have the correct push rod length.

------------------
Alex Denysenko
Co-Administrator and Moderator
NHRA/IHRA/SRA member
NHRA and IHRA SS/LA National Record Holder '00 & '01
Fleet of FoMoCo products
Moneymaker Bio
US Class Nationals link

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n2oMike
Gearhead

Posts: 1511
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001

posted 06-28-2001 10:56 AM     Click Here to See the Profile for n2oMike   Click Here to Email n2oMike     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Stock heads and 8.5 compression?

I'd say anything over 218 @ 0.050" is more than what you can take advantge of.

I've had the mustang since high school. It's been through all sorts of combinations from stock 2bbl engine, auto tranny, and 2.80 8" open rear, to what it is now.

With a stock engine that had a little more compression than yours, it ran GREAT with a Crane 272 Max Velocity cam. I believe it had an intake duration of 216 deg @ 0.050". It redlined around 5500 rpm, and had great power from around 2-5.5k.

Too large of a cam will only cost you low-end and midrange power... and won't really give you much (if any) more on top due to the pathetic compression ratio and asmatic heads.

Good Luck!

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Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/cmml/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367

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