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Author
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Topic: My 351c build-up, have I missed anything?
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Rustang351c
Journeyman Posts: 45
From: Watkinsville, GA, USA
Registered: Jun 2001
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posted 06-08-2001 04:59 PM
   
I have a 69 fastback. Have been working on it a while, an am finally about ready to roll! This is what all I've done:71' 351c, .030 over, TRW flat-tops, oil restr. kit w/ "MPG" oil reroute hose, windage tray, arp rods bolts, 4v heads, new single grove moroso valves, shaved .030, polished bowl & exhaust side, MPG Exhaust plates, HarlandSharp Rockers, guideplates, etc..ReedCam,solid, 243-254 @ .050, .573-.606 lift, 110 centers, 77overlap. BarryGrantSportsman950cfm, Torker Intake, BG 250gal.pump, Weindwaterpump, MSD distr., Crane digital6 box, MSDwires, 9qt.pan, mellingpump, HookerSuperComps(1-7/8) 3��exh. EdelbrockRPMmufflers,SouthsideLiftbars,SubframeConn,SuperStiffSprings,15x10��s,26��tall,4.11traclok,ATI c-4,8��converter(3500stall I think),huge cooler, Cam is supposed to build up to 7200+/-? What kinda HP & ET do you think it��ll get? Will it still be streetable on Friday&Sat nights? Didn��t fill the block any? Anything I missed? Thanks Russ
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Russ
86 Capri 5.0
69 Stang Fastback 351c
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MrXerox
Gearhead Posts: 322
From: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Registered: Nov 2000
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posted 06-08-2001 08:31 PM
I would lose the exhaust port plates and that carb sounds a little big to get a good signal....Just my .02
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SteveLaRiviere
Administrator Posts: 32961
From: Saco, Maine
Registered: May 99
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posted 06-08-2001 08:43 PM
Don't forget the hardened oil pump drive shaft.Do you have a windage tray? ------------------
'70 Mustang Mach 1 M code 351C 4V/FMX/3.50 open
'72 Mustang Sprint Coupe 351C 4V/FMX/4.30 Trac Lok
'94 F-150 XL 5.8L/E4OD/3.55 Limited Slip
'97 Probe GTS 2.5L DOHC {Wife's car...}
All Fords since 1977
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66351stang
Gearhead Posts: 677
From: sayville,newyork
Registered: Jul 2000
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posted 06-08-2001 09:17 PM
i agree, loose the plates and carb is greatly oversized for the work done to the motor------------------
ponycar66,have you flown in a ford latley???????
66-COUPE W/351SVO
glad i had a v-8 !!!!!!
84.5 gt350-61 falcon 302
have a great day!!!!!!!!
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 1511
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 06-09-2001 07:59 AM
I agree with ditching the port plates, but not nececcarily the carb. Most of these "modified" carbs are based on 750 double pumpers that have been smoothed out and had an 850 baseplate installed. If it has the 750 venturi size (750 main body), it will be fine.Are they closed chamber 4V heads? Flat tops with closed chamber heads would be about right for a streetable compression with that cam. Sounds like a really good, well thought out combo to me.... I like it, all I would do is hunt down one of those new Funnelweb intakes! You can see them in detail at www.fordmuscle.com. It should be plenty streetable. Well... maybe a shot of nitrous.  Good Luck! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/cmml/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
[This message has been edited by n2oMike (edited 06-09-2001).]
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kid vishus
Gearhead Posts: 4357
From: middle of NC
Registered: Oct 2000
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posted 06-09-2001 09:21 AM
I will agree, lose the port plates. Also, if the convertor really is an 8", it more than likely has alot more stall than 3500 rpm.
Sounds like a good combination. Even if the heads are open chambered, being shaved and with flat tops will still give decent compression.
I would think strongly though about putting an electric fan on the trans cooler for slow traffic situations.
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Rustang351c
Journeyman Posts: 45
From: Watkinsville, GA, USA
Registered: Jun 2001
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posted 06-09-2001 04:17 PM
Thanks for the responses guys. OK, will leave off the MPG plates. Yeah, the carb is a reworked 750DP. Yes, they are the 71 closed heads, Yes, have a trans cooler, hardened oil shaft, and windage tray. I'm pretty sure the converter is 8", could be 9". I gave ATI my cam spec.s / car info and they sized it for me. I asked for a 3000, they said it would be upper 3000's, just depending on my engine strenghten and set-up.but,.... any horse power or ET estimates?! ------------------
Russ
86 Capri 5.0
69 Stang Fastback 351c
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SteveLaRiviere
Administrator Posts: 32961
From: Saco, Maine
Registered: May 99
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posted 06-10-2001 01:50 PM
Russ, if you give me your intake and exhaust valve openings and closings, I'll run your combo on my PC dyno and see what it says.------------------
'70 Mustang Mach 1 M code 351C 4V/FMX/3.50 open
'72 Mustang Sprint Coupe 351C 4V/FMX/4.30 Trac Lok
'94 F-150 XL 5.8L/E4OD/3.55 Limited Slip
'97 Probe GTS 2.5L DOHC {Wife's car...}
All Fords since 1977
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denny
Journeyman Posts: 54
From: Northfield NH USA
Registered: Jul 2000
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posted 06-11-2001 06:59 AM
I ran a very similar combo in a 73 stang 3650# with driver but I have a 4sp best et 11.74@ 116.82 engine dynoed 468 hp@6700 and 424 ft lbs. @ 5000 I had an 850 carb and 2 inch headers. I tried the 780 carb off my Fairlane and the 'stang slowed .15-.2 and lost 2 mph. ------------------
D French
67 427 Fairlane(A/SA) 73 Mustang 351c
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MrXerox
Gearhead Posts: 322
From: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Registered: Nov 2000
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posted 06-11-2001 08:10 AM
denny, do you remember what jets, squirters and pump cams you ended up using? I have a similar combo with an 850 as well...
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denny
Journeyman Posts: 54
From: Northfield NH USA
Registered: Jul 2000
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posted 06-11-2001 01:35 PM
I ran the 850 just like it was right out of the box. 80 jets front and rear. I never fiddled with squirters or cams as I was running heavey eliminator with it back in the early 90's and the break for the class was 12.00 I liked having the big speed and slow ET If i shifted @ 6500 I would run 12.0's @114 in around 1000ft of air. I'm sure there was some more ET in the carb and the suspension as my average 60ft was 1.68- 1.70 Best ever being a 1.65------------------
D French
67 427 Fairlane(A/SA) 73 Mustang 351c
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70coupe
Gearhead Posts: 346
From: Toronto,Ontario,Canada
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 06-11-2001 01:36 PM
You have more cam that I do but as for the rest other than the following parts we're pretty close. I'm running a Weiand x-cellerator(dont think its helping me) and a crane solid .554/.577 with 238/248 duration @ .050 and 108 centreline and a C-6 tranny. I cant believe all I can get from my 3440lb car with driver is 13.16@105mph.
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MrXerox
Gearhead Posts: 322
From: Oklahoma City, Oklahoma
Registered: Nov 2000
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posted 06-11-2001 02:38 PM
Wonder how many "get rid of the C-6" replies this is gonna bring?!
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Jim Sams
Journeyman Posts: 55
From: Charlotte NC
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 06-11-2001 03:49 PM
quote:
Originally posted by 70coupe:
You have more cam that I do but as for the rest other than the following parts we're pretty close. I'm running a Weiand x-cellerator(dont think its helping me) and a crane solid .554/.577 with 238/248 duration @ .050 and 108 centreline and a C-6 tranny. I cant believe all I can get from my 3440lb car with driver is 13.16@105mph.
What gears are you running?
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 1511
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 06-11-2001 06:18 PM
I'm porting a set of 351C heads with 2bbl heads, and the Weiand Accelerator intake for that application has ports that are quite a bit larger than the ports in the head. There is a serious overlap. I'm having to grind out a LOT of metal to open the heads up far enough. Are yours 2bbl heads? If so, there might be a little grinding in your future.Yours sounds like a great combo if you've got closed chamber heads for a decent compression ratio. Are those funnelweb intakes readily available yet? Good Luck! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/cmml/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
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70coupe
Gearhead Posts: 346
From: Toronto,Ontario,Canada
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 06-11-2001 07:19 PM
I am running 4:11's and the heads are closed chamber.
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 1511
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 06-11-2001 08:57 PM
How about the converter? What is the 60ft? It might need a little looser unit.A buddy of mine (also running a C6) made HUGE gains with a decent exhaust. He was running manifolds, 2.5" exhaust, turbo mufflers, and 2.25" tailpipes. After switching to a set of $79 Dynomax 1 3/4" headers and 3" exhaust (no tailpipes) he gained a full second in the 1/8 mile! Oh yea, he was using nitrous too.... which does -wonders- for picking up the 60ft. Good Luck! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/cmml/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
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70coupe
Gearhead Posts: 346
From: Toronto,Ontario,Canada
Registered: Aug 2000
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posted 06-11-2001 09:57 PM
My 60's are awful. 1.98-2.00. 1/8th mile 8.45@84, 1/4 [email protected]. Right now I'm running a 10" so called 3500 but I'm only flashing to about 2800. Wednesday I will be picking up my new 8 3/4" converter, they say I will get at least 3500. Time will tell. The converter alone should help my 60's and put me into the high 12's. Crane says my cam works from 3000-6500.
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 1511
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 06-12-2001 10:13 AM
quote:
Originally posted by n2oMike:
A buddy of mine (also running a C6) made HUGE gains with a decent exhaust. He was running manifolds, 2.5" exhaust, turbo mufflers, and 2.25" tailpipes. After switching to a set of $79 Dynomax 1 3/4" headers and 3" exhaust (no tailpipes) he gained a full second in the 1/8 mile!
Oh yea, he was using nitrous too.... which does -wonders- for picking up the 60ft.
Just to avoid any confusion, he WAS using the nitrous before and after the exhaust change. The exhaust was what dropped the car a full second in the 1/8. He's running a 351C with a set of used TRW domed pistons, used 750 Vacuum Holley, used Offy Port-o-Sonic intake that I ported (leading edge out of the plenum is really sharp and needs serious radiusing), 2bbl heads with zero port work but good hardware, 230/244 112 LSA cam (nitrous grind), 1 3/4" $79 Headers, 3" exhaust, C6 w/stock converter, 4.11 Detroit Locker, and a used set of 26x10 Hoosier slicks. No traction bars, but an extra "dead leaf" at the front of the springs. The car is a butt-*** ugly 72 Mach 1, and is nicknamed "Turdstang". It is FULL weight, and has no fiberglass parts, and stock interior and remnants of AC. It also runs just fine on pump gas. With a used 200hp TopGun nitrous system engaged from the line, it 60fts in the high 1.5's to low 1.6's. Best 1/8 mile is a 7.27 @ 92. The car hasn't made it to the 1/4 yet with this combo. The old worn out engine went 11.86 @ 112 with a 230/230 110LSA cam and a Performer intake. This engine produces a LOT more top end than the old one. MPH in the 1/4 will be fun!  The car scares all the local ricers and is a budget-mobile that really works! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/cmml/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
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SteveLaRiviere
Administrator Posts: 32961
From: Saco, Maine
Registered: May 99
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posted 06-17-2001 06:41 PM
From Russ:
Subject:
351c cam spec's from "Rustang351c"
Date:
Sun, 17 Jun 2001 11:06:07 -0400
From:
"Russ -"
To:
[email protected]
>Russ, if you give me your intake and exhaust valve openings and >closings,
>I'll run your combo on my PC dyno and see what it says.
Sorry I'm so slow getting back to you. Could find my cam card.
OK: Intake Opens: 41^BTDC
Intake Close: 73^ABDC
Exhaust Opens: 84^BBDC
Exhaust Closes:36^ATDC Intake enterline 106^
Exhaust Centerline 114^
Cam Lobe Centers 110^ Advertised Duration: 294-300
.050 Duration : 243-254
Lobe lift: .331" .350"
Valve Lift: .573" .606" "My 351c build-up, have I missed anything" Look but at my post for engine
info. Thanks for running this on your program. I'm very curious. Russ Marlowe
Watkinsville Georgia
_________________________________________________________________
Get your FREE download of MSN Explorer at http://explorer.msn.com
I ran the data on my Motion PC Dyno software {take all PC dynos with a HUGE grain of salt} and it came up with 422 hp @ 7500, and 342 lbs/ft @ 6000. Since it has my milder cammed 351C producing 474 hp @ 6500/ 417 lbs/ft at 5500, either my PC dyno is wacky or it doesn't like your cam. I tried my 780 instead of your 950, and the power drop was minor. {409 hp/ 336 lbs/ft} Any opinions? My 351C has L2379F flat tops, 10.7:1, closed chambers, pocket ported, 3 angle, my cam is the Motorsport A341 {.510"/.536" 214/224 degree @ .050 lobe lift} duration, 107/117.} ------------------
'70 Mustang Mach 1 M code 351C 4V/FMX/3.50 open
'72 Mustang Sprint Coupe 351C 4V/FMX/4.30 Trac Lok
'94 F-150 XL 5.8L/E4OD/3.55 Limited Slip
'97 Probe GTS 2.5L DOHC {Wife's car...}
All Fords since 1977 [This message has been edited by SteveLaRiviere (edited 06-17-2001).]
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