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Author
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Topic: Engine troubles.... Please Help!!
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myouzicman
Journeyman Posts: 10
From: Waldorf, MD USA
Registered: Sep 2005
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posted 12-13-2005 08:26 PM
   
Ok, here goes. I have a 66' coupe that I installed an 86' 302 with edelbrock performer intake and 1406 carb. I've been trying to get it to stay running since I put it in a couple of days ago. So today the first time I fired it up it stayed running just idled a little too high. So I cut it off to look for a screwdriver to adjust the carb. When I went to start it again it wouldn't start without the throttle being half open. But once it started again it was idleing way too high. I hadn't even made any adjustments yet. So I cut it off and tried again this time it backfired and once it started idled way too high again. So while I was scratching my head I was checking the fluids just to make sure I still had plenty. And the oil now seems to have fuel in it. It seems too runny and smells of fuel. If anyone has any tips for these two problems it would be much appreciated. I really want to be able to drive this baby again. I just put $1500 worth of welding work into the floors and main frame rails. If you have any questions just let me know. Thanks!
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Fastymz
Moderator Posts: 21741
From: Reno Nv USA M&M#1240
Registered: Apr 2001
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posted 12-13-2005 08:29 PM
Is the carb new out of the box, did you adjust anything on it?
If there is gas in your oil. Change the oil before restarted the motor.------------------
oddly obsessed with big scoops on little Mustangs HOOD HACKERS DELIGHT!
My Pics
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68 Coop
Gearhead Posts: 4040
From: Mesquite, NV. 89027 M&M# 4256
Registered: Oct 2004
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posted 12-13-2005 09:42 PM
Are you sure you dropped the distributor back in right??? Sounds kinda like the timing is off. TDC the #1 piston and mark the house and check it, for gits and shiggles.------------------
William "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog."
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myouzicman
Journeyman Posts: 10
From: Waldorf, MD USA
Registered: Sep 2005
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posted 12-13-2005 10:24 PM
Ok, as far as the carb it's newer but had been adjusted before it went on this motor. Was on original motor. I'm going to have to check the timing again. These may seem like stupid questions but I'm kinda new to engine building so when the #1 cylinder is at top dead center the piston on that cylinder should be all the way up? and when that is achieved should the rotor button be pointing towards #1 on the cap?
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68 Coop
Gearhead Posts: 4040
From: Mesquite, NV. 89027 M&M# 4256
Registered: Oct 2004
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posted 12-14-2005 01:31 AM
Remove the coil wire first. Take the #1 plug out, put your finger over the hole, and turn the engine over. When the pressure blows your thumb off the hole, it's at TDC. Now watch your marks, and turn it back to 0. Mark the dist house where #1 is on the cap, take off the cap and see where the rotor is pointing. If it's off, you will have to restab it, and start over. Timing lights are good to get them dialed in with, but I have better luck with setting it, then driving it, until I like it best. These are the basics, so if you have trouble understanding anything, post and we will get this thing right.------------------
William "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog."
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Jake11
Gearhead Posts: 207
From: Banning,Ca,USA
Registered: Oct 2005
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posted 12-14-2005 03:34 AM
Holly, right?
Oh oh.
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myouzicman
Journeyman Posts: 10
From: Waldorf, MD USA
Registered: Sep 2005
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posted 12-14-2005 08:04 PM
Ok guys round 2 started at 3pm and just ended. This is what I found out. First off the fuel smell in my oil was the brand new fuel pump leaking into the timing chain cover. So I took the one off the original motor and installed it. So after that I changed the oil and cranked her up. She purred like a kitten! But I didn?t leave it running for long because I had to eat dinner. So after I ate I went back out and it would turn over but not start. Earlier in the day I had pulled the plugs and all of them had fuel on them. So putting two and two together I figured maybe I was periodically not getting fire. When the distributor was in the old motor I installed an Ignitor II, and Flamethrower coil. So I went to the coil with a test light. Positive side lit up light a christmas tree. So I put the test light on the negative side and touched the probe to the positive post on the battery. Very faint light! With the key off it also lights up like a christmas tree, but as soon as the key hits the on position it drops down to just about nothing. And as I crank the motor it blinks from bright to nothing. Do you think that maybe the fact that it?s not keeping ground could be the problem. Would I be able to run a wire from a grounded spot to the negative post on the coil. What do you guys think?
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68 Coop
Gearhead Posts: 4040
From: Mesquite, NV. 89027 M&M# 4256
Registered: Oct 2004
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posted 12-15-2005 11:28 AM
I don't know what, if anything, this will help, but it's some info on how to wire the Pertronix the "right" way. Click on tech tips.http://www.vintage-automotive.com/ Anyway, best to ya, and I'm almost positive this thread is not done yet. ------------------
William "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." [This message has been edited by 68 Coop (edited 12-15-2005).]
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mustangboy
Gearhead Posts: 1198
From: Ont, Canada
Registered: Mar 2002
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posted 12-15-2005 05:21 PM
All of the symptoms you describe in your first post sound like the choke was on or at least the fast idle part....Having to start a warm engine by opening the throttle is a sign of too much gas,or being slightly flooded.Once you had the engine running and then shut if off at high idle speeds it would tend to flood it slightly which could cause a backfire or a bit of run on.Are you sure your fuel pump is leaking gas into the oil?..If the car is running a little rich the oil will stink a little like gas.If its pumping gas in the oil will get very thin and watery feeling.------------------
68 J-Code,Sprint,306 4 speed,4.11s 13.69@101...............
66 coupe 289 4 speed, 3.20 cruiser http://mustangsandmore.50megs.com/MembersPics/mustangboy.html http://mustangsandmore.50megs.com/MembersPics/mustangboy2.html
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myouzicman
Journeyman Posts: 10
From: Waldorf, MD USA
Registered: Sep 2005
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posted 12-18-2005 12:49 AM
Yea it was definitely leaking gas into the oil. There is no doubt about that. What appears to be happening is that I'm not getting enough spark. It keeps flooding and I pulled a wire off and cranked it to check the spark and it seems really weak. I'm wondering if maybe something is wrong with the petronix module I put in. It's getting very frustrating and I had to just walk away from it for a couple of days. I know it runs because I have had it running. It just doesn't want to do it every time. Once before after I had installed the petronix and the new coil on the old motor it took a long time for it to start one day. I wonder if something is wrong with it where it acts up occasionally. For a couple of days there it would start every time I cranked it up the first time and then not at all afterwards and would end up flooding. My patience is wearing very thin with this thing, all I want to do is be able to drive my car again. Any suggestions of a fail safe ignition system I could install that wouldn't break the bank?
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Jake11
Gearhead Posts: 207
From: Banning,Ca,USA
Registered: Oct 2005
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posted 12-18-2005 01:59 AM
Don't ever quit!
Sound's like two overlaping prob's. Got to
narrow it down. Can you put the old point's
setup back in for testing? I can tell you
how to fix it if you want to work with me.
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68 Coop
Gearhead Posts: 4040
From: Mesquite, NV. 89027 M&M# 4256
Registered: Oct 2004
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posted 12-18-2005 09:18 AM
My car started doin similar things, so I just went and got a Red Top, and it fires every time now. I just have to be really careful that I don't flood it on cold starts, so I press the acc 1 time, let it sit for a few sec, and BARELY touch the gas during start-up. This is ONLY while it's cold, any other time I can reach in the window and start it no prob.
Just a thought, but if the Pertronix unit and the Magnet ring aren't flush on top, you might be losing spark there too. Just something to consider, I had a time finding this out for myself. Luck, and keep us up to speed if you can.------------------
William "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog." [This message has been edited by 68 Coop (edited 12-18-2005).]
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 2899
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 12-18-2005 10:29 AM
You do know that new and old engines have different firing orders, right?Old 15426378 New 13726548 The 1986 engine will have the new firing order. On another note. I suppose you also know that the newer engine will have a differently balanced harmonic balancer and flywheel. Good Luck! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220
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eric
Journeyman Posts: 21
From: Dublin Ireland
Registered: Sep 2005
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posted 12-18-2005 11:40 AM
i
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eric
Journeyman Posts: 21
From: Dublin Ireland
Registered: Sep 2005
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posted 12-18-2005 11:47 AM
68 coop to stop my 69 from flooding I fitted a wire to a horn type button from the battery + to the coil + to boost the spark for those cold starts or when people sit in and push all the pedal's
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DidgeyTrucker
Gearhead Posts: 1681
From: Greenbrier, TN USA
Registered: Oct 99
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posted 12-18-2005 12:30 PM
quote:
Originally posted by eric:
68 coop to stop my 69 from flooding I fitted a wire to a horn type button from the battery + to the coil + to boost the spark for those cold starts or when people sit in and push all the pedal's
That's what the extra little wire on the starter relay is for. It bypasses the ballast resistor and sends a full 12 volts to the coil. Tracy
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rmousir
Gearhead Posts: 778
From: Amelia, Ohio
Registered: May 2003
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posted 12-18-2005 01:23 PM
Hey, Just wanted to know if you got your motor running again??What was the problem?? Richard.
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68 Coop
Gearhead Posts: 4040
From: Mesquite, NV. 89027 M&M# 4256
Registered: Oct 2004
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posted 12-18-2005 04:16 PM
quote:
Originally posted by eric:
68 coop to stop my 69 from flooding I fitted a wire to a horn type button from the battery + to the coil + to boost the spark for those cold starts or when people sit in and push all the pedal's
Would that be the same as by-passing the pink resistor from the ignition switch??? I haven't did that part yet either, but since it starts OK now, I didn't think it was important. Thanks for any info you can give on this, and thanks for the space myouzicman.------------------
William "It's not the size of the dog in the fight, it's the size of the fight in the dog."
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eric
Journeyman Posts: 21
From: Dublin Ireland
Registered: Sep 2005
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posted 12-19-2005 08:42 PM
quote:
Originally posted by DidgeyTrucker:
That's what the extra little wire on the starter relay is for. It bypasses the ballast resistor and sends a full 12 volts to the coil.Tracy
Maybe mine's not doing its job right as after some one rams too much petrol into the engine the direct feed was the only thing that did the trick without waiting around for it to settle.
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