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Author
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Topic: 351W heads compatable with 289 block?
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65blowncoupe
Journeyman Posts: 13
From: Paola, KS
Registered: Apr 2004
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posted 04-05-2004 02:27 PM
 
Does anyone know if 351 windsor heads are compatable with a 289 block 1965 mustang. I am wondering if I am not getting a steam pocket on my new motor due to a water passage way being blocked or a gasket blocking a passage way. I just don't know for sure if the ports and passage ways match. Any help is appreciated.
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 3058
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 04-05-2004 02:44 PM
The steam holes do NOT line up. But, this would cause overheating, not pressurization of the cooling system without the engine getting hot. (which is what you said the problem was earlier)Use the gasket as a guide, and either drill the block or head with a 3/16" bit. Personally, I would drill the head. There will probably be three steam holes in the gasket. The top center one is for the 289 block (whose steam hole is directly above the cylinder, toward the lifter valley) The ones on either side are used on pretty much every other Ford small block. They line up with the coolant holes between the cylinders. Double check every hole before drilling. Things can get switched up going from side to side, etc. I still think you have a gasket that is leaking pressure under boost. Make SURE your timing is under control before installing premium gaskets and ARP bolts. Good Luck! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220
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bifs66
Gearhead Posts: 313
From: Maryland
Registered: Apr 2000
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posted 04-05-2004 03:42 PM
I don't know if this helps but......My vintage Ford Muscle Parts instruction book states that the 289 head gaskets should be used when installing 351W heads on the 289 block. However, the book doesn't state why this should be done (smaller head bolts??). They also say to use the 351W intake manifold gaskets. I think this was because the early 351W heads had the "L" shaped water passage and the 289 intake gasket would leak. It's also recommended to use the late 1969 302 push rods to accommodate the 0.100" longer valves in the 351W heads.------------------
Bernie Frank
66 Fastback restomod (12.8 @ 112mph)
85 GT (preserved)
2000 SVT CONTOUR
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65blowncoupe
Journeyman Posts: 13
From: Paola, KS
Registered: Apr 2004
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posted 04-05-2004 10:53 PM
quote:
Originally posted by n2oMike:
The steam holes do NOT line up. But, this would cause overheating, not pressurization of the cooling system without the engine getting hot. (which is what you said the problem was earlier)Use the gasket as a guide, and either drill the block or head with a 3/16" bit. Personally, I would drill the head. There will probably be three steam holes in the gasket. The top center one is for the 289 block (whose steam hole is directly above the cylinder, toward the lifter valley) The ones on either side are used on pretty much every other Ford small block. They line up with the coolant holes between the cylinders. Double check [b]every hole before drilling. Things can get switched up going from side to side, etc. I still think you have a gasket that is leaking pressure under boost. Make SURE your timing is under control before installing premium gaskets and ARP bolts. Good Luck! [/B]
Thanks, Mike for your reply... I found out a few hours ago that pre 1972 289 & 302 blocks do not fit Rousch or 351Windsor heads. From what I understand there are 3 holes that need to be drilled 1/4" to 3/16" diameter to mate with the water jackets on the block. I think the lack of water moving in those cavities heats up the heads and the water in that area boils and causes steam which pressurizes the water and is blowing out the overflow from the radiator cap. Even when the engine is off for 10 minutes there is still air bubbling out of the overflow bottle from the overflow hose (diminshed significantly) but still visible. The steam pocket that was created would continue to boil for a short while after the car is off and then fade out just like the bubble fade out. The head gaskets are o-ringed steel and the car has only been driven 50 miles and not all at once. Never had it even above 3,000 rpm. I really don't think the head gasket is blown, especially now that I know the modification to the heads were not done by my engine builder. I'll keep you up to date. Here are some pics of the car. http://www.brigadegunleather.com/65mustang.html
[This message has been edited by 65blowncoupe (edited 04-05-2004).]
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65blowncoupe
Journeyman Posts: 13
From: Paola, KS
Registered: Apr 2004
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posted 04-06-2004 02:47 PM
n2oMike...Your help was appreciated with the info on the drilling the heads. Do you think after that they will be good to go or do you think I should just buy new heads that match?
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 3058
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 04-09-2004 08:34 PM
Drilling the existing heads should make them work, but aftermarket heads would definitely pick up the horsepower. Plus, the thicker decks offered by aftermarket wouldn't hurt anything when it comes to keeping the gaskets in place.Good Luck! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220
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65blowncoupe
Journeyman Posts: 13
From: Paola, KS
Registered: Apr 2004
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posted 04-10-2004 10:00 AM
Thanks. The heads were taken off yesterday and drilled. It was so easy to spot the 4 steam holes above each cylinder in the block that were not drilled in the head. So after drilling all 8 holes total and the car was put back together the problem is solved. With the new aluminum racing radiator and fan and high volume water pump and high flow thermostat my idle temp is 152deg and when I am getting on it hard the temp still remains at 152deg. Oil temp ranges between 150-180. I think my car runs a little too cool now. I may have to block part of the large oil cooler I put on since the oil temp might be a little low.[This message has been edited by 65blowncoupe (edited 04-10-2004).]
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 3058
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 04-10-2004 11:28 PM
I'm glad it worked out for you!By the way, the Edelbrock and AFR heads come from the factory with a 'universal' steam hole that works with all blocks... so using these is a safe bet for anyone. Good Luck! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/carbedstangs/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
http://www.mustangworks.com/cgi-bin/moi-display.cgi?220
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