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Author
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Topic: 351C INFO NEEDED
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mmsports
Journeyman Posts: 10
From: Toledo, Ohio
Registered: Jan 2002
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posted 01-03-2002 03:12 PM
   
I am in the process of building a new Boss Cleveland motor for my drag car. I have been looking for a while now for a kit that was used a lot in the 70's and 80's. It is an oil log that ties into the 2,3,& 4 mains and sits under the intake manifold. One kit was made by Hank the Crank, but they no longer produce it and will not give me any info on how to do it my self. I have seen many pictures of it. But i am trying to find the locations for drilling into the block to hook up the log. If any one can help me with this, i would appreciate it greatly. Thank you Kyle Mourdock ------------------
'84 5.0 GT, 5 Speed,
'88 GT, Full tube chassis, Boss 351, Tunnel Ram, 14:1, powergilde, 9.1 sec 1/4 mile on motor
'67 Ford Cobra, 427 side oiler, t-56, 4 wheel independent suspension
'56 Corvette all original
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kid vishus
Gearhead Posts: 3858
From: middle of NC
Registered: Oct 2000
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posted 01-03-2002 04:20 PM
First of all, welcome to M&M.  Cool,  another cleveland racer. I'm not help. I have never seen that kit or any pics of anything like it. Perhaps you could call Animal Jim, I bet he would know where to drill. Not to be a smarta**, but what would the advantage of that be? Granted I'm not making as much power as you, but I have more problems with the blocks than I do with the oiling system now. I would really like to hear more about your cleveland, and your racecar in general. Rob
1969 Mustang Fastback, 2750# w/driver
351 cleveland
Best ET 9.97 1/4, on the motor
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mmsports
Journeyman Posts: 10
From: Toledo, Ohio
Registered: Jan 2002
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posted 01-03-2002 06:05 PM
What the log does it supply oil directly to the 2,3, &4 mains. On a cleveland, the # 1 main is supplied directly of the main pressure pasage from the oil pump. 2,3,4, & 5 are supplied after the valve train and lifters are feed. you can directly plumb main # 5 by running a oil line from the port by the fuel pump mount to the port that is between the cylinder head on the back of the motor. But to get to 2,3,& 4 you have to run this log or something like it. I know you have to drill 3 holes in the lifter valley, but not sure where, then drill a hole in the back of the motor to allow for the oil line to come thur. As for my engine, the following are the specs: '71 boss block, 4 bolt mains, arp main and head studs, arp bolts all around. MPG windage tray, eagle I beam rods, Ross 14:1 Forged Pistions, Childs & ALberts Rings, Balanced and blue printed, FRP balancer, Crane Solid Roller lifters, Isky Cam - .769" valve lift, 2.25" intake, 1.95" exhaust, K Motion triple valve springs, Titanium retainers & locks, Offenhouser Tunnel Ram, Dual Race Demon 850 Carbs, 4V heads, machined for rocker studs, blended chambers, 3 angle valve job, crane gold 1.73 rocker arms, rocker arm stud girdle. That is about all i can remember off my head. The car is an 88 GT full tube chassis, all steel body expect hood, 9" rear, 35 spline axles, 5.12 gear, 33x19.5x15 slicks, 32" ladder bars, tubular k member- tubular a-arms, lakewood 90/10 struts, with coil over conversion, flaming river rack. last year was a best of 9.154 in the 1/4. i lunch the car at 5200 rpm and shift at 8900 rpm, never had any problem with the engine runs great. The engine pulls like a raped ape. If i wanted to i could rev it more, but i dont want to hurt the engine. I was told that with all i have in the motor, it could handle 10,000 rpm but i dont want to chance it. Do you have Animal Jims number so i could try him. I dont know him so any help getting ahold of him would be good. Kyle ------------------
'84 5.0 GT, 5 Speed,
'88 GT, Full tube chassis, Boss 351, Tunnel Ram, 14:1, powergilde, 9.1 sec 1/4 mile on motor
'67 Ford Cobra, 427 side oiler, t-56, 4 wheel independent suspension
'56 Corvette all original
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SteveLaRiviere
Administrator Posts: 30756
From: Saco, Maine
Registered: May 99
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posted 01-03-2002 06:16 PM
I remember seeing that Hank the Crank log. If I remember right it was just plumbed line that exited the rear of the block by the oil sending unit location. I bet anywhere you drill and tap in the lifter oil galley would be just as effective. So would the external line a lot of guys use from the front plug tap to the sending unit port. ------------------
'70 Mustang Mach 1 M code 351C 4V/FMX/3.25 open
'72 Mustang Sprint Coupe 351C 4V/FMX/4.30 Trac Lok
'94 F-150 XL 5.8L/E4OD/3.55 Limited Slip
'97 Probe GTS 2.5L DOHC
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mmsports
Journeyman Posts: 10
From: Toledo, Ohio
Registered: Jan 2002
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posted 01-04-2002 12:43 PM
the log itself is under the intake manifold. There is a line that runs thru the back of the block just below the intake manifold. That line can go thru any place. That is the easy part. The block has to be drilled in 3 spots in the lifter valley to reach the 2,3,4, mains. The location of the 3 holes is what i am looking for. I have no idea where to drill. i know the general area, but not exact. ------------------
'84 5.0 GT, 5 Speed,
'88 GT, Full tube chassis, Boss 351, Tunnel Ram, 14:1, powergilde, 9.1 sec 1/4 mile on motor
'67 Ford Cobra, 427 side oiler, t-56, 4 wheel independent suspension
'56 Corvette all original
IP: Logged |
kid vishus
Gearhead Posts: 3858
From: middle of NC
Registered: Oct 2000
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posted 01-04-2002 04:55 PM
Here is Animal Jim's number : (309)-246-8556I have spoken with him a couple of times, and he's quite a character. Although I seriously doubt if he would remember me, and I'm sure I never told him my name. If it's been done to a cleveland, he's probably tried it. He told me about several motor combo's he ran in his pro stock day, a 365 ci motor that he twisted 10,700 rpm, a 430 ci motor based on an australian block that he reved 9500, and the list goes on. My motor "only" sees 8000 rpm (and thats during the burnout), and I was told by Animal that with stock rods that is about all I should twist it. I shift at 7500, 2 step it to 4600, and my convertor flashes 6400. Is your motor a stock crank/stroke motor?
Regardless, it sounds like it runs real hard.
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Mpcoluv
Gearhead Posts: 799
From: Charlotte NC usa
Registered: Apr 2001
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posted 01-04-2002 05:08 PM
Hank the crank was out of business.
Price motorsporst makes a kit that runs a line from the oil pump outlet to the back of the block at the sending unit hole at the last main bearing.
The kit you are referring to is shown in the "Ford Performance" book by Pat Ganahl.
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kid vishus
Gearhead Posts: 3858
From: middle of NC
Registered: Oct 2000
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posted 01-04-2002 05:35 PM
The more i think about it, the more I know I have never heard of anyone using a system like that. A freind of mine, who used to run clevelands in an old pro stock, told me that they bushed the lifter bores, used the restrictor kit, and a belt driven oil pump with a dry sump system. The one thing he said they did was plug the lifter valley returns to externally return the oil. He said they did that to keep oil of the crankshaft and it was a much more efficient and faster way of returning the oil to the tank.Do your main bearings look like they are oil starved now? My main bearings have never looked bad, not even when I knew less than now and kept kicking the rods out. But I havent had that problem in a long time.
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mmsports
Journeyman Posts: 10
From: Toledo, Ohio
Registered: Jan 2002
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posted 01-04-2002 07:30 PM
I have never had any problems with my mains, i just want to spin more rpms, and i was told by a fellow cleveland racer before i go higher up i should add this log or something like it. I am in the process of freshing up the motor, no bearings and stuff. Everything in the block is in perfect shape. no scrapes or anything in the cylinder bores or any where. I figured while i had it apart, if i could find this log i would install it. ------------------
'84 5.0 GT, 5 Speed,
'88 GT, Full tube chassis, Boss 351, Tunnel Ram, 14:1, powergilde, 9.1 sec 1/4 mile on motor
'67 Ford Cobra, 427 side oiler, t-56, 4 wheel independent suspension
'56 Corvette all original
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kid vishus
Gearhead Posts: 3858
From: middle of NC
Registered: Oct 2000
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posted 01-04-2002 08:13 PM
Preventative parts  That motor must be making some tremondous power. I tried a 'glide in my car 2 yrs ago and the convertor was wrong for the motor combo, it slowed the car down .3 in the 1/8.  Put my C4 back, and it picked the et back up. Do you happen to know the duration @ .050 on your cam? I am kind of curious as to how much camshaft it takes to spin up that high and still make power. I know mine isnt big enuff (like the bottom of my motor would live anyways  ).
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Fordwiser
Gearhead Posts: 181
From: Metamora, Illinois
Registered: Dec 2000
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posted 01-06-2002 02:31 PM
Welcome from another Cleveland racer!
Taking a look at the Ford Performance book and looking at one of my bare blocks, with the mains facing up, if you stuck a long drill bit down the passage feeding the mains on 2,3 and 4 and drilled all the way thru, it would go right thru the right lifter galley and out top of the block in the lifter valley. Then you would have to thread in some sort of tube so it would be feed from the top instead of the lifter galley. Seems like a big ordeal, and I think I would practice on a junk block before risking your good block.
I think a lot of the Prostock clevelands were done with the bushed lifter bores to limit bleed off and direct more oil to the mains. I'm thinking about this on mine, since I have it apart for the winter also, probably overkill for me but every little bit helps. Also, if you have this done at a shop that has a Lifter Tru machine it assures that every lifter bore will be aligned perfectly which is said to help horsepower due to exact cam timing cylinder to cylinder. Hope this helps a little!
Roger
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richard bohm
Gearhead Posts: 373
From: tucson,az-luray,va
Registered: May 2001
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posted 01-07-2002 12:44 PM
use the restrictor kit available from summit and bush the lifter bores. run a high volume/high pressure oil pump and limit the oil pressure to 80 psi and you should ahve no problems. if you think you need more, contact the winston cup engine builders and ask what they do. waddel wilson did what i told you to do and had great success. remember they turn 8500 for 4 hours.
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Mpcoluv
Gearhead Posts: 799
From: Charlotte NC usa
Registered: Apr 2001
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posted 01-07-2002 04:29 PM
I use the Price motorsports restrictor kit with the lifter galler restriction opened up to .125" for my hyd. cammed 372C.
Works fine with the HV pump.
Too bad you can't easily put the restrictors in.....
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Fordwiser
Gearhead Posts: 181
From: Metamora, Illinois
Registered: Dec 2000
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posted 01-07-2002 07:07 PM
This should be in the racing forum, maybe would get more ideas.
Roger
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Fordwiser
Gearhead Posts: 181
From: Metamora, Illinois
Registered: Dec 2000
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posted 01-13-2002 09:53 PM
mmsports, did you ever get ahold of Animal Jim? Interested in what he had to say on the subject.
Roger
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franklin
Gearhead Posts: 128
From: VA
Registered: Nov 2000
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posted 01-13-2002 11:20 PM
Speaking of 351c stuff, have you guys ever seen rocker arms like these? This is a company from australia. http://www.yellaterra.com.au/images/rockers.gif If you get to the site, look under "rockers" and notice how you adjust the valve lash with a screw on top of the pushrod. http://www.yellaterra.com.au/ [This message has been edited by franklin (edited 01-13-2002).]
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mmsports
Journeyman Posts: 10
From: Toledo, Ohio
Registered: Jan 2002
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posted 01-14-2002 11:28 PM
No i haven't gotten ahold of Jim yet. I have been out of town on vacation. Trying to get some rest in.  I am going to try and get ahold of him this week. i will update you all on what he says. I finally got my new engine back from the machine shop. God i love this new cam. It sounds like an NHRA Pro Stock car when i start the engine. An unbelievable sound. I also recieved my new rocker arm stud girdles from Jomar. They are so much better then Moroso's version. No more u-bolts. Jomar uses Aluminum beams. SO much stiffer. I cant wait for this season to start. I am getting the itch already. See you all at Norwalk this april.
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'84 5.0 GT, 5 Speed,
'88 GT, Full tube chassis, Boss 351, Tunnel Ram, 14:1, powergilde, 9.1 sec 1/4 mile on motor
'67 Ford Cobra, 427 side oiler, t-56, 4 wheel independent suspension
'56 Corvette all original
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