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Author
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Topic: 400 ci ?
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67mike
Gearhead Posts: 164
From: Arab,AL
Registered: Mar 2001
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posted 05-14-2001 10:35 AM
   
What about 400's. Are they any good pro's/con's? I have a line on one but a friend said they are not worth a crap, Also went to Rocket city mustang club annual car show. (Huntsville Al. area)A real nice show. About 100 + cars. Mike
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Fastback68
Gearhead Posts: 1746
From: Sucat, Paranaque, Philippines
Registered: Jul 99
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posted 05-14-2001 10:50 AM
I asked the same question here over a year ago, and was also told they aren't worth a crap. I guess the responses are somewhere in the archives, but they don't seem to go back that far. Anyway, I don't remember anyone saying anything good about them.
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steve'66
Gearhead Posts: 6602
From: Sonoma,CA,USA
Registered: Mar 2000
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posted 05-14-2001 11:07 AM
They're good for pick-up trucks.  They're heavy and not well supported by the aftermarket.SteveW
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Rustang1
Gearhead Posts: 110
From:
Registered: Nov 2000
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posted 05-14-2001 12:25 PM
I always wanted to build one. Cleveland flat tops, 4V open chamber heads, and top it off with a strip dominator with spacer plates. I would think such a combo with a mild cam (.550 to .600 lift range)could be built for very cheap and the rod ratio is good. The extra cubes should wake up the 4V heads down low.
Hot Rod built one a couple years ago and it put out 400hp with 2V heads and very mild hydraulic cam for under $2000.00------------------
1968 Mustang,Clevor,C4
1969 Torino 351C 4spd
1978 F150 460 C6
1978 F150 351W C6
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joe
Gearhead Posts: 517
From: Los Angeles
Registered: Feb 2001
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posted 05-14-2001 12:48 PM
I'm always hearing from people and reading in mags that those are not worth your time. In the junkyards here there are tons of 400s, 351Ms. Doesn't look like anyone wants them.
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 1590
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 05-14-2001 01:25 PM
Most 400's came with a 429/460 bellhousing pattern, but some (73' car engines mostly) came with the small block bellhousing pattern. This is the one to get if you're interested in swapping a 400 in place of a 289/302/351W/351C.One major drawback is the lack of a flat-top piston. This can be solved by bushing the small end of the connecting rods for the smaller 351C pin, and using forged TRW 351C flat-top pistons which are just over $200 a set from most places. (351C and 400 pistons are identical except for pin diameter)
Another option is using the "standard" dished piston along with a set of Australian 351C heads. (These are identical to the regular 351C 2bbl/400 heads except they have closed 351C 4bbl style combustion chambers)
Both methods will give an adequate compression ratio. (Stock is really low, around 7.9 to 1) ...and is not really high enough to take advantage of much larger cams than stock.
Pumping the compression ratio up a bit and installing larger carb/intake/cam... and installing headers and big exhaust will pump some serious oats into one of these engines. The first year this engine was offered, it came with flattop pistons, and ran pretty good. After that, emissions kicked in, so retarded cams, low c.r. and all really turned it into a gas sucking turd. For the serious hot-rodder, 4bbl closed chamber 351C heads can be bolted on with no problem, and really cool intakes available for the 351C can be used with spacer plates available from Price Motorsport Engineering. A 400 with 4bbl 351C heads, a Funnelweb intake, and all the fixings would definietly be a "different" way to make some serious horsepower! Hmmm... 400ci would be just about right for 351C 4bbl heads.  Good Luck! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/cmml/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
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TomP
Gearhead Posts: 4838
From: Delta BC Canada
Registered: Dec 99
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posted 05-15-2001 01:35 AM
its still awfully large and heavy, 460 sized and 390-428 weight. the early 70-71 400's were the high compression ones, still not real powerful but not much was in the 70's.
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Big_blocker
Journeyman Posts: 50
From: On a rock in the pacific (Hawaii)
Registered: Mar 2001
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posted 05-15-2001 03:44 AM
I was messing around with this idea for a while to. But what made me deiced not to build it was the lack of Aftermarket steel rods. I think this engine will become popular at some point and time. With parts from the 351C and some NOS this engine would rock.I say go for it try it out it cant be to bad as people think it is.
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Drink gas haul a$$ American Racing [This message has been edited by Big_blocker (edited 05-15-2001).]
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 1590
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 05-15-2001 08:34 AM
Here's a picture of 400 block that uses the small block bellhousing. Yes, they DO exist. There's a guy who used to be on the fordnatics list who built one for a Pantara. It uses 4bbl heads and webber carbs to make 670hp. http://members.tripod.com/lyc_42/fengpix1/odd400.jpg ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/cmml/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 1590
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 05-15-2001 12:56 PM
quote:
Originally posted by n2oMike:
It uses 4bbl heads and webber carbs to make 670hp.
I'm sorry, I was mistaken... It was -only- 570hp. Here are the dyno numbers and the engine combo... Awseome, flat torque curve, if you ask me... Subject: 400 Dyno Results RPM HP TQ
2000 158 415
2500 212 445
3000 274 480
3500 352 527
4000 431 566
4500 500 583
5000 543 571
5500 567 541
6000 577 505
6500 567 458 Here are the engine parts:
Ford 400 FMX block, bored .030", 4-bolt main
Stock rods/crank
Arias forged pistons
351C 4V heads, ported, 2.19/1.76 SS valves, 11:1 CR
Comp Pro Magnum 1.73 intake/1.8 exhaust roller rockers
Hall Pantera manifold
PME intake spacers
Weber 48 IDA's, 45mm chokes, Inglese needle/seats/circuits
Comp 32-771-8 Magnum roller cam
GTS Equal-length 2" headers
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Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/cmml/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367
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richard bohm
Gearhead Posts: 373
From: tucson,az-luray,va
Registered: May 2001
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posted 05-17-2001 04:13 AM
the 400 can be built to make some serious power but a 460 or stroked 351w would be cheaper by far. also both motors have far more int he way of parts availablity. if you want a big block build a 460. if you want a lighter motor but with cubes a stroked 351w is the way to go.
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Rustang1
Gearhead Posts: 110
From:
Registered: Nov 2000
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posted 05-17-2001 11:59 AM
By the way, does anybody know the weight difference between the 400M and the 460?------------------
1968 Mustang,Clevor,C4
1969 Torino 351C 4spd
1978 F150 460 C6
1978 F150 351W C6
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74merc
Gearhead Posts: 760
From: Demopolis AL
Registered: Jun 99
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posted 05-17-2001 12:53 PM
weight difference?
about 60 cubic inches of air... 
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n2oMike
Gearhead Posts: 1590
From: Spencer, WV
Registered: Jan 2001
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posted 05-17-2001 01:08 PM
I'm not saying the 400 is the greatest thing out there... just that it -is- capable of making power, will kinda' bolt in place of a small block with the right block, will pass for a 351C to most people, and is different!The right recipe will produce good power, look cool, and be one great conversation starter! You could talk about an engine like that for hours.... Dollar-wise, it's not the most -efficient- way to make power, unless you've already got all the parts and have access to inexpensive machine work, but it can extract some good power for a guy limited to mostly factory parts. Dare to be Different???? Have Fun! ------------------
Mike Burch
66 mustang real street
302 4-speed 289 heads
10.63 @ 129.3
http://www.geocities.com/motorcitymustang/cmml/cmml_mburch.html
http://www.fortunecity.com/silverstone/healey/367 [This message has been edited by n2oMike (edited 05-17-2001).]
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