I did this swap on my 66 back around 15 years ago back in high school. The local junkyard sold me the "conversion kit" for $125. This included everything... pedals, clutch linkage and hardware, flywheel, bellhousing, clutch, trans, etc. All used, but all usable.

It's not really that big of a deal, and it makes the car feel way faster, and it's lots more fun to drive in my opinion. However, there are a few things to look out for.

Toploader transmissions came in several varieties. One big thing is the length of the pilot shaft. This is the tittie that sticks into the pilot bushing. Small blocks have a longer one. It's just over an inch long. Big blocks are only around 3/4" and will not reach into the pilot bearing of a small block. Do NOT use the shorter big block behing a small block. Extended pilot bushings are availabe, but they WILL come loose, which trashes the transmission... Trust someone who has been there and done that. Most agree that small block transmissions can be used in big blocks, though...

Tailshaft length is another issue. The big cars used a very long tailshaft. Mustangs and fairlanes and torinos used a shorter one. The mustang's shifter mount is on the very back of the tailshaft housing. The fairlane/torino mount is up a bit further. If you use a fairlane/torino tailshaft housing, the shifter won't come up through the existing hole, and you'll be banging your knuckes on the dash on quick 3rd gear shifts. Another "been there, done that" story. That conversion kit from the junkyard used parts from a fairlane.

Really, with all the right parts, it's not that bad at all. If a high school kid can pull it off with fairlane parts, you can do it.

For transmission info and parts, see...

Dan Williams Toploaders, which is an EXCELLENT source of parts and rebuild kits. Go for the bronze syncronizer rings.
http://www.toploadertransmissions.com/

Or..

David Kee Toploaders, who is affiliated with Dan Williams.
http://www.4speedtoploaders.com/

There's lots of great info at both sites. The both sell most of the same stuff. Dan Williams is the original and usually has the best prices.

Good Luck!

The shifter won't be as tight or close as a new Hurst, but it will get you started. You can always change it later. I like the Hurst Competition Plus, myself. That's what's in my car, and has been for 15 years now.

Good Luck!

Yea, the first time I installed one of those I was quite hostile after cussing on my back for around a solid hour... before figuring out that by removing the clutch pedal stop would allow for an easy 30 second installation. This stop catches the pedal on the way UP. By removing it, the pedal comes up really far, allowing the spring to be slid right on. It is then re-attached.

#4 I think that the starter is also different???

The manual and automatic starters are different. The automatic starter will NOT work with the manual trans... been there, tried that, didn't work. :)

n20Mike: You mentioned that a SBlock Toploader can be used behind a BBlock,,which is true - however, a few things need to be done.

#1. The longer pilot nose on the SB unit
should be cut down some; or it will bottom out in the BB pilot bearing and put excessive pressure on the crankshaft and thrust bearing.

#2. The 10-spline input shaft is 1 3/8" diameter on the BB unit vs. 1 1/16" diameter on the SB unit; so you must use the appropriate clutch disc.

#3. The output shaft spline counts are different. On the SB Toploader it will be 28-spline and the BB Toploaders will be 31-spline. So use the appropriate yoke.

#4. Lastly we need to remember-SB Toploaders include those put behind 390's. So when we talk about BBF's, we're talking about 427s, 428s, & 429s.

These issues shouldn't be a concern with KV's setup, but for anybody else who may be following this thread and don't know what their parts came out of, they may want to check these things out.

Later, Ryan

#1. The longer pilot nose on the SB unit
should be cut down some; or it will bottom out in the BB pilot bearing and put excessive pressure on the crankshaft and thrust bearing.
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Mike sez...
Dan Williams, of Dan Williams Toploaders states that it works fine "uncut". If it makes you feel better, cutting it down to size won't hurt anything, though.

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#2. The 10-spline input shaft is 1 3/8" diameter on the BB unit vs. 1 1/16" diameter on the SB unit; so you must use the appropriate clutch disc.
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Mike sez...
Big block units were not all large input. Big block toploaders are identified only by the shorter pilot on the input shaft. Big block transmissions that came behind 390's had the smaller 1 1/16" input shaft with the short pilot... which is a big block only, small input/output transmission.

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#3. The output shaft spline counts are different. On the SB Toploader it will be 28-spline and the BB Toploaders will be 31-spline. So use the appropriate yoke.
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Mike sez...
All big input toploaders have the 31 spline output, which is common to the C6. All small input toploaders have the 28 spline output (except for the very first mustang 25 spline units that were recalled) which is common to the C4. BTW, Mark Williams Enterprises is the only place that makes an aftermarket 28 spline slipyoke. I had to get one several years ago, and it's holding up great. It uses a #1350 1 ton truck U-joint.
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#4. Lastly we need to remember-SB Toploaders include those put behind 390's. So when we talk about BBF's, we're talking about 427s, 428s, & 429s.
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Mike sez...
Nope, as said above, they have the short pilot, and are therefore big block units. The small pilot will not work behind a small block. These have the small (1 1/16") input and 28 spline output.
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Mike also sez...
The small input transmissions are quite strong. They are all I've ever used in the mustang, and it gets launched HARD with the nitrous on at 6000RPM to a best 60ft of 1.43 in a car that is 3300lbs with driver. The car has only had one transmission related sudden failure. This was the output shaft. It broke in half once, taking out the tailshaft housing. This must have been a fluke, because there have never been any failure before or since. No input shaft problems either.

The weakest links I've had to deal with are the slipyokes. The car twisted the splines in several before the Mark Williams unit was purchased. It cost $170 several years ago, and a new driveshaft had to be made for it, but zero problems.

When rebuilding these things, make sure to get the BRONZE syncro rings that are avaiable from Dan Williams and David Key. The brass units are very inferior. Stock ford rings were bronze as well.

I'm curious to try a close ratio unit. I picked one up with great gears last summer, but it is a 390 galaxie unit with the short pilot and long output shaft. I'm going to have the pilot lengthened by a machinist and install a short tailshaft and housing that are in the spare parts bin... It should be fun, and might take a little violence out of the nitrous launches.

Have Fun!

I think you are saying, that the Toploaders that came behind the 390s were of the smaller 1 1/16" diameter input shaft BUT had the shorter nose, whereas all other 1 1/16" input units had a longer nose and went behind the 289s, 302s, & 351s. And, that all the large 1 3/8" diameter input had the shorter nose.
Does that sound correct? If so, I didn't realize that difference...

In addition, I hadn't heard of the slipyokes being prone to breakage - that a MW or equivalent aftermarket piece should be used. Good Advise!!

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Mike sez YES! I believe the small input/short pilot shaft combo only came behind 390's, but there might be other applications I don't know about. All I really know for sure is that they won't work behind a 289's, 302's, 351W's or 351C's. The small blocks all require the longer pilot shaft.
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And that all the large 1 3/8" diameter input had the shorter nose. Does that sound correct?

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Mike sez YES! As far as I know... I can't think of a big input/long pilot combo off the top of my head.
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In addition, I hadn't heard of the slipyokes being prone to breakage - that a MW or equivalent aftermarket piece should be used. Good Advise!!

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Mike sez, "I didn't have any luck with the Spicer units, and the MW piece solved all problems.
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So Mike, when you mention you're using the "small input trans in your '66", you are refering to the 1 1/16" shaft, long nose SB unit, right?

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Mike sez YES!
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If so, that is proof that they are pretty tough! Would you use one behind a big block/stick running on a 11" slick?

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Mike sez, "It depends upon the big block, and more importantly, the amount of traction and the weight of the vehicle." I've been lucky so far.
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Good Luck!